My experience with puerh has so far been limited to looseleaf and mini
tuocha. But I just ordered some green puerh cakes and mushrooms.

Is it common for a cake or mushroom to be so hard that you have to break
it up with a towel and hammer? I had been kind of imagining I'd be able
to just break off a piece with my fingers until I saw a website
suggesting a hammer. Seems a little sad in a way, to smash something so
artfully put together all at once - but perhaps that's better than
keeping a towel and hammer at the office.

And should I try to use a quantity of puerh about the same volume as a
mini toucha?

Dan Stromberg > writes:

> My experience with puerh has so far been limited to looseleaf and mini
> tuocha. But I just ordered some green puerh cakes and mushrooms.
>
> Is it common for a cake or mushroom to be so hard that you have to break
> it up with a towel and hammer? I had been kind of imagining I'd be able
> to just break off a piece with my fingers until I saw a website
> suggesting a hammer. Seems a little sad in a way, to smash something so
> artfully put together all at once - but perhaps that's better than
> keeping a towel and hammer at the office.

I prefer to do it less violently. If you use a rigid blade that isn't
too sharp, you can pry off a reasonable amount by digging into the
cake and trying to go "with the grain". I figure you smash the leaves
less that way. If you can pry off a thin layer at a time, you stand a
better chance at getting the leaves to infuse at the same rate.

> And should I try to use a quantity of puerh about the same volume as a
> mini toucha?

If you're doing it by volume, I suppose it should be slightly less, to
allow for the extra compression.

/Lew
---
Lew Perin /
http://www.panix.com/~perin/babelcarp.html

On Mon, 15 Mar 2004 00:54:03 GMT, Dan Stromberg
> cast caution to the wind and posted:

>My experience with puerh has so far been limited to looseleaf and mini
>tuocha. But I just ordered some green puerh cakes and mushrooms.
>
>Is it common for a cake or mushroom to be so hard that you have to break
>it up with a towel and hammer? I had been kind of imagining I'd be able
>to just break off a piece with my fingers until I saw a website
>suggesting a hammer. Seems a little sad in a way, to smash something so
>artfully put together all at once - but perhaps that's better than
>keeping a towel and hammer at the office.
>
>And should I try to use a quantity of puerh about the same volume as a
>mini toucha?


I use a pair of pliers to just break off a hunk from highly compressed
cakes. I have found it to be very effective.

I have recently purchased a puerh knife specially designed for the
task. It is a small pointed but dull knife with a triangular handle.
It greatly resembles a letter opener, only the blade is thicker. The
idea is to pierce the cake and then twist the knife to break off
pieces of leaf.

I still like my pliers better, they may be less elegant but they are
very effective and less risk of an accident with a pointed object.

As for quantity, I would start with the same WEIGHT as your tuochas
and then adjust to taste. I have always preferred the repeatability of
a scale. A scale eliminates variances due to differing density levels,
uncalibrated eyeballs, etc. You can get a cheap pocket scale with a
digital readout for less than $40 nowadays. Once you get to know a
particular tea you can just break off a chunk and steep it up.



Mike Petro
http://www.pu-erh.net
remove the "filter" in my email address to reply

OK, next question for the experts: how do you introduce the tea to the
water? That is, does one just wait for the leaves to open and separate, or
do you poke around with a special puerh prodding pestle? I guess it doesn't
matter for extended multiple steeps; it all comes out in the wash. But for
those rock-hard mini-tuochas, especially, I'm wondering if there's benefit
to more handling.

Back to Lew and Mike's advice: the few tuochas and beenchas I've tried so
far seemed like very big leaves. I had good luck peeling off slices about 1
mm thick with a big, very sharp chef's knife. Since the leaves start so big,
and the clean cut makes little if any dust, does this seem like an OK way to
do it?

Thanks-

DM (slowly getting to enjoy what looks like used motor oil and tastes like
barnyard runoff)

I've had puerh bricks that can be broken with thumbs, and one that needed
medieval weapons to prise the smallest bit off. The tougher one wasn't as
flavorful.

Is there any consistent difference in the taste or quality between less hard
and more hard? I don't have enough samples to go on.

Peter

"Dog Ma 1" (reply w/o spam)> wrote in message
news
> OK, next question for the experts: how do you introduce the tea to the
> water? That is, does one just wait for the leaves to open and separate, or
> do you poke around with a special puerh prodding pestle? I guess it
doesn't
> matter for extended multiple steeps; it all comes out in the wash. But for
> those rock-hard mini-tuochas, especially, I'm wondering if there's benefit
> to more handling.
>
> Back to Lew and Mike's advice: the few tuochas and beenchas I've tried so
> far seemed like very big leaves. I had good luck peeling off slices about
1
> mm thick with a big, very sharp chef's knife. Since the leaves start so
big,
> and the clean cut makes little if any dust, does this seem like an OK way
to
> do it?
>
> Thanks-
>
> DM (slowly getting to enjoy what looks like used motor oil and tastes
like
> barnyard runoff)
>
>

On Sun, 14 Mar 2004 22:19:24 -0800, "Peter" > cast
caution to the wind and posted:

>I've had puerh bricks that can be broken with thumbs, and one that needed
>medieval weapons to prise the smallest bit off. The tougher one wasn't as
>flavorful.
>
>Is there any consistent difference in the taste or quality between less hard
>and more hard? I don't have enough samples to go on.
>
>Peter

I am told that the hardness of a brick can be an indicator of the
quality of the factory, with harder cakes indicating better factories,
not necessarily better tea. Beyond that I do not think it makes much
difference in black puerh. The hardness and shape can make a
difference when aging green puerh though, because it affects the
natural oxidation process. Particularly, oxidation throughout the cake
can be uneven. I think this is why collectors often favor bingchas as
they oxidize evenly due to uniform thickness.




Mike Petro
http://www.pu-erh.net
remove the "filter" in my email address to reply

On Mon, 15 Mar 2004 03:47:33 GMT, "Dog Ma 1"
(reply w/o spam)> cast caution to the wind and posted:

>OK, next question for the experts: how do you introduce the tea to the
>water? That is, does one just wait for the leaves to open and separate, or
>do you poke around with a special puerh prodding pestle? I guess it doesn't
>matter for extended multiple steeps; it all comes out in the wash. But for
>those rock-hard mini-tuochas, especially, I'm wondering if there's benefit
>to more handling.
>
>Back to Lew and Mike's advice: the few tuochas and beenchas I've tried so
>far seemed like very big leaves. I had good luck peeling off slices about 1
>mm thick with a big, very sharp chef's knife. Since the leaves start so big,
>and the clean cut makes little if any dust, does this seem like an OK way to
>do it?
>
>Thanks-
>
>DM (slowly getting to enjoy what looks like used motor oil and tastes like
>barnyard runoff)
>

I have read in some older texts that hundreds of years ago they would
actually use a mortar and pedestal type device to crush the cakes. I
have also been told that in tribal neighborhoods they just throw a
whole cake in a large stock pot size pot and share it all day long.

Personally if I have the time to do multiple steeps I don't worry
about it so much. I just break it up as much I can and increase the
steep time for the 2 steeps. The only question I have is the
effectiveness of the rinse when the leaves are still in small
compressed chunks. How does this less effective rinsing affect the
flavor?

If I only have time for a single steep I try to break it up as uniform
as possible without pulverizing it.

Mike Petro
http://www.pu-erh.net
remove the "filter" in my email address to reply

Dan 3/14/04


> My experience with puerh has so far been limited to looseleaf and mini
> tuocha. But I just ordered some green puerh cakes and mushrooms.

Good for you, Dan. Seems as though Mike's turning us all in the right
direction.
>
> Is it common for a cake or mushroom to be so hard that you have to break
> it up with a towel and hammer? I had been kind of imagining I'd be able
> to just break off a piece with my fingers until I saw a website
> suggesting a hammer.

Between fingers and a hammar is a knife to pry up a chunk along an edge.
(Finger blood is considered an appropriate pu-erh additive.) This ought to
work in most cases. I've gotten some green pu-erhs from Michael Ryan of M
and J's and from David Hoffman of Silk Road Teas. I've got a life of happy
adventure ahead of me. I also am the proud possessor of a two kilo brick
which I don't want to hack up, but would rather cut into four neat squares.
Any suggestions on how to do this?

>Seems a little sad in a way, to smash something so
> artfully put together all at once - but perhaps that's better than
> keeping a towel and hammer at the office.

Well, what you do with your towel and hammar at the office is of course your
own business. I'd try the knife first. I agree about destroying such
artfully put together tea. Tea SM?
>
> And should I try to use a quantity of puerh about the same volume as a
> mini toucha?

Lew Perin, my green pu-erh mentor, goes with something like 160-170F degrees
and approximately half the number of grams as the number of ounces of water.
This seems to work admirably well. Without a gram scale, I'd say a
mini-toucha's worth would be good for four or five ounces, assuming
approximately two grams per toucha. Multiple steeps, of course. What say you
Lew?

The finger blood comment is a joke. Be real careful with that knife. Take it
from me. I notice that Michael Ryan's site includes a sort of triangular
(pyramidal?) pu-erh knife without sharp edges. I might give that one a try
myself.

Michael

> I also am the proud possessor of a two kilo brick
> which I don't want to hack up, but would rather cut into four neat
squares.
> Any suggestions on how to do this?

A back saw, also called a mitre saw, is a square handsaw with a wide blade
of thin steel. Makes perfectly square cuts. Hacksaw would work, if you clean
the paint off the blade first. Or maybe it wouldn't affect the taste.

> >Seems a little sad in a way, to smash something so
> > artfully put together all at once

Or maybe a core drill, taking it out from the middle to keep the brick
externally intact.

> I notice that Michael Ryan's site includes a sort of triangular
> (pyramidal?) pu-erh knife without sharp edges.

If you don't mind mixing rituals, Tibetan arts stores sell a
triangular-bladed dagger called a phurba. It's meant to be used for ritually
slaying evil spirits, but I suppose sacrificing a toucha to the beverage
gods might qualify.

Wish I'd saved one of the antique book presses I used to use for printing
woodcuts. They'd be perfect to crack up the big cakes without making dust.

Boy, all this technology just for a cuppa-

DM

As the recent recipient of several puerh cakes (from Michael Ryan via Michael
Plant -- thanks, MP), I am also entering this arcane world. One cake was
introduced to finger blood just last night, in fact.

>I notice that Michael Ryan's site includes a sort of triangular
>(pyramidal?) pu-erh knife without sharp edges

I love esoteric, single-purpose tools. I have an odd offset wrench that
adjusts the tension of my leather bike saddle -- and nothing else will fit in
there.

A further question -- what is the purpose of such extreme compression anyway?
(In the very hard cakes, that is.) Theory: storage made easy without a
container because the great bulk of the cake is not exposed to air?

Joe

Joseph 3/15/04


> As the recent recipient of several puerh cakes (from Michael Ryan via Michael
> Plant -- thanks, MP), I am also entering this arcane world. One cake was
> introduced to finger blood just last night, in fact.
>
>> I notice that Michael Ryan's site includes a sort of triangular
>> (pyramidal?) pu-erh knife without sharp edges
>
> I love esoteric, single-purpose tools. I have an odd offset wrench that
> adjusts the tension of my leather bike saddle -- and nothing else will fit in
> there.
>
> A further question -- what is the purpose of such extreme compression anyway?
> (In the very hard cakes, that is.) Theory: storage made easy without a
> container because the great bulk of the cake is not exposed to air?
>
> Joe


Finger Blood Pu-erh (FBPE) -- could be the start of something new.

Perhaps extreme compression slows down whatever processes advance the tea?
Just conjecture.

Hope your finger's OK.

Michael

After the sledgehammer for the smaller fragments Dremmel and
needlenose vise grips. For the office I recommend a wood carving set
with phantom ink well so your boss thinks you're practicing Chinese
caligraphy.

Jim

Dan Stromberg > wrote in message . uci.edu>...
> My experience with puerh has so far been limited to looseleaf and mini
> tuocha. But I just ordered some green puerh cakes and mushrooms.
>
> Is it common for a cake or mushroom to be so hard that you have to break
> it up with a towel and hammer? I had been kind of imagining I'd be able
> to just break off a piece with my fingers until I saw a website
> suggesting a hammer. Seems a little sad in a way, to smash something so
> artfully put together all at once - but perhaps that's better than
> keeping a towel and hammer at the office.
>
> And should I try to use a quantity of puerh about the same volume as a
> mini toucha?

>For the office I recommend a wood carving set
>with phantom ink well so your boss thinks you're practicing Chinese
>caligraphy.

Boss: "Whew...thank goodness he's practicing Chinese calligraphy...I thought
he was goofing around with those tea-cakes again."

On Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:52:59 -0800, Joseph Kubera wrote:


> A further question -- what is the purpose of such extreme compression
> anyway? (In the very hard cakes, that is.) Theory: storage made easy
> without a container because the great bulk of the cake is not exposed to
> air?
>
> Joe

My wife tells me originally nomadic people liked them because they were
easy to carry. But I'd guess there's (come to be) something there about
aging just so too.

> > A further question -- what is the purpose of such extreme compression
> > anyway? (In the very hard cakes, that is.) Theory: storage made easy
> > without a container because the great bulk of the cake is not exposed to
> > air?
> >
> My wife tells me originally nomadic people liked them because they were
> easy to carry. But I'd guess there's (come to be) something there about
> aging just so too.


Tea jerky?

Highly compressed stuff is less prone to absorb water in damp environments,
and also to absorb liquid if accidentally dunked. Or to crumble in a
backpack. Maybe less risk of bug infestations as well?

Mike Petro > wrote in
:
....
....
> As for quantity, I would start with the same WEIGHT as your tuochas
> and then adjust to taste. I have always preferred the repeatability of
> a scale. A scale eliminates variances due to differing density levels,
> uncalibrated eyeballs, etc. You can get a cheap pocket scale with a
> digital readout for less than $40 nowadays. Once you get to know a
> particular tea you can just break off a chunk and steep it up.
>
>
>
> Mike Petro
> http://www.pu-erh.net
> remove the "filter" in my email address to reply

A good digital pocket scale is about $32 total at:
http://www.saveonscales.com/120Z.html
Mine arrived six days after ordering.

I'm not affiliated with the website.

This site http://www.digitalscale.com/ reviews scales
and lists several vendors.

Dog Ma /15/04
reply w/o spam

>>> A further question -- what is the purpose of such extreme compression
>>> anyway? (In the very hard cakes, that is.) Theory: storage made easy
>>> without a container because the great bulk of the cake is not exposed to
>>> air?
>>>
>> My wife tells me originally nomadic people liked them because they were
>> easy to carry. But I'd guess there's (come to be) something there about
>> aging just so too.
>
>
> Tea jerky?
>
> Highly compressed stuff is less prone to absorb water in damp environments,
> and also to absorb liquid if accidentally dunked. Or to crumble in a
> backpack. Maybe less risk of bug infestations as well?

Speciaion, time, and tide should produce strains of insects perfectly
capable of handling either the loose or hard packed bricks. Nature is
wonderfully adaptive.

Michael
>
>

On 15/03/04 13:58, in article
, "Dog Ma 1"
reply w/o spam> wrote:

> If you don't mind mixing rituals, Tibetan arts stores sell a
> triangular-bladed dagger called a phurba. It's meant to be used for ritually
> slaying evil spirits, but I suppose sacrificing a toucha to the beverage
> gods might qualify.


That's probably mixing rituals but I've found out an oyster knife does very
well when trying to break a pu-erh cake.

On 15/03/04 13:58, in article
, "Dog Ma 1"
reply w/o spam> wrote:

> If you don't mind mixing rituals, Tibetan arts stores sell a
> triangular-bladed dagger called a phurba. It's meant to be used for ritually
> slaying evil spirits, but I suppose sacrificing a toucha to the beverage
> gods might qualify.


That's probably mixing rituals but I've found out an oyster knife does very
well when trying to break a pu-erh cake.