Hello,

I have recently gotten back into tea after a several-year teabag hiatus
(due to laziness). I was really irritated at how tinny my tea tasted
from the tea ball, and I tried those do-it-yourself tea bags with loose
leaf tea, but the space was simply too cramped (esp. if brewing more
than one cup at a time).

Anyway, I recently bought the Teeli infuser basket (medium size) and
had been brewing cup-by-cup (6 oz teacup). Results: excellent. The
problems began when I wanted to make tea for my girlfriend as well,
i.e. 2 cups at a time.

So I went out and bought a 2-cup teapot (although in reality it holds
16 oz, which is like 2 and 2/3 cups). The infuser almost fits into it,
though to push it all the way in requires some flex of the plastic
frame. In a way, that is excellent in its own right because it produces
a fairly tight seal to keep the heat in while brewing -- and I use the
Teeli infusers little black lid during the brewing process.

Now, the problem is this: if I actually use 2 and 2/3 teacups' worth of
water (i.e. 16 oz, approx 500 mL), then the water level comes almost
all the way up the mesh of the infuser. That's great. However, I
usually want to brew EXACTLY 2 cups' worth, i.e. 12 oz. If I pour in
only 12 oz. of water, the water definitely rises above the height of
the *dry* leaves, but the level is a little over an inch (1 1/8") shy
of the full height of the infuser basket: about 3 cm to be exact.

So my question is this: assuming I use about 2 tsp worth of dry leaf,
and the water level not only covers the dry leaf, but rises a bit more
than halfway up the infuser, is that enough space and is that a proper
spatial configuration for a proper infusion? I'm sort of ignorant of
the technical and scientific aspects of it.

My observations are that when I brew in a single-cup with the infuser,
and fill the water almost all the way to the top, the leaves are
usually lurking around at the bottom anyway (for black teas). So it
shouldn't make too much difference in the 2-cup pot, when there isn't
a lot of water *on top* of the leaves. Presumably in the pot since
there is much more space *around* (i.e. outside the infuser basket to
the sides), that the flavours and chemical goodies of the tea infuse
outward that way.

But I am concerned about green teas. Greens usually seem to have a much
higher proportion of leaves that float to the top of the infuser
basket, whether I fill it up all the way, or halfway. Also, the
unfurled leaf sizes in greens tend to be enormous (I am using sencha
and gyokuro, mainly). So I am worried that with 2 tsps my teeli infuser
is over-matched in that specific pot.

Of course the easiest thing to do to ease my mind is just to fill the
pot nearly all the way, which means 16 oz. But I really don't want to
get 2 decent cups, and then 2/3's of a cup of "dregs" -- drank after,
and tending to be dusty and tannic. Also, I would have to use at least
2.5 teaspoons of tea, and I would rather not waste tea.

So... is it simply enough to "cover" the tea leaves with water
(ignoring the ones that float to the top)? Keep in mind that when I
re-steep and the leaves are already wet and engorged, the water level
still rises above the level of the leaves. So should I be concerned
about the gravity aspect? Is it simply enough for there to be lots of
water space around the sides, on the inside of the pot?

Would appreciate any advice on this subject. Thanking you all in
advance for your sinentic wisdom...

wrote:
> Now, the problem is this: if I actually use 2 and 2/3 teacups'
> worth of water (i.e. 16 oz, approx 500 mL), then the water
> level comes almost all the way up the mesh of the infuser.
> That's great. However, I usually want to brew EXACTLY 2 cups'
> worth, i.e. 12 oz. If I pour in only 12 oz. of water, the
> water definitely rises above the height of the *dry* leaves,
> but the level is a little over an inch (1 1/8") shy of the
> full height of the infuser basket: about 3 cm to be exact.

Good god, man, tea isn't this complicated. Just get a small tea
pot or a Japanese kyuusu. Maybe a mesh strainer for when you
pour into the cups. That's it, that's all you need.

--crymad

wrote:
> Now, the problem is this: if I actually use 2 and 2/3 teacups'
> worth of water (i.e. 16 oz, approx 500 mL), then the water
> level comes almost all the way up the mesh of the infuser.
> That's great. However, I usually want to brew EXACTLY 2 cups'
> worth, i.e. 12 oz. If I pour in only 12 oz. of water, the
> water definitely rises above the height of the *dry* leaves,
> but the level is a little over an inch (1 1/8") shy of the
> full height of the infuser basket: about 3 cm to be exact.

Good god, man, tea isn't this complicated. Just get a small tea
pot or a Japanese kyuusu. Maybe a mesh strainer for when you
pour into the cups. That's it, that's all you need.

--crymad

I keep two pots and two infusers. Me no have to think.

A Chatsford (for smaller volumes, they come in several sizes) and a standard
store-bought one quart porcelain pot and a large "Swiss gold tea filter"
(from Stash) for larger volumes.

Warren

> wrote in message
oups.com...
> Hello,
>
> I have recently gotten back into tea after a several-year teabag hiatus
> (due to laziness). I was really irritated at how tinny my tea tasted
> from the tea ball, and I tried those do-it-yourself tea bags with loose
> leaf tea, but the space was simply too cramped (esp. if brewing more
> than one cup at a time).
>
> Anyway, I recently bought the Teeli infuser basket (medium size) and
> had been brewing cup-by-cup (6 oz teacup). Results: excellent. The
> problems began when I wanted to make tea for my girlfriend as well,
> i.e. 2 cups at a time.
>
> So I went out and bought a 2-cup teapot (although in reality it holds
> 16 oz, which is like 2 and 2/3 cups). The infuser almost fits into it,
> though to push it all the way in requires some flex of the plastic
> frame. In a way, that is excellent in its own right because it produces
> a fairly tight seal to keep the heat in while brewing -- and I use the
> Teeli infusers little black lid during the brewing process.
>
> Now, the problem is this: if I actually use 2 and 2/3 teacups' worth of
> water (i.e. 16 oz, approx 500 mL), then the water level comes almost
> all the way up the mesh of the infuser. That's great. However, I
> usually want to brew EXACTLY 2 cups' worth, i.e. 12 oz. If I pour in
> only 12 oz. of water, the water definitely rises above the height of
> the *dry* leaves, but the level is a little over an inch (1 1/8") shy
> of the full height of the infuser basket: about 3 cm to be exact.
>
> So my question is this: assuming I use about 2 tsp worth of dry leaf,
> and the water level not only covers the dry leaf, but rises a bit more
> than halfway up the infuser, is that enough space and is that a proper
> spatial configuration for a proper infusion? I'm sort of ignorant of
> the technical and scientific aspects of it.
>
> My observations are that when I brew in a single-cup with the infuser,
> and fill the water almost all the way to the top, the leaves are
> usually lurking around at the bottom anyway (for black teas). So it
> shouldn't make too much difference in the 2-cup pot, when there isn't
> a lot of water *on top* of the leaves. Presumably in the pot since
> there is much more space *around* (i.e. outside the infuser basket to
> the sides), that the flavours and chemical goodies of the tea infuse
> outward that way.
>
> But I am concerned about green teas. Greens usually seem to have a much
> higher proportion of leaves that float to the top of the infuser
> basket, whether I fill it up all the way, or halfway. Also, the
> unfurled leaf sizes in greens tend to be enormous (I am using sencha
> and gyokuro, mainly). So I am worried that with 2 tsps my teeli infuser
> is over-matched in that specific pot.
>
> Of course the easiest thing to do to ease my mind is just to fill the
> pot nearly all the way, which means 16 oz. But I really don't want to
> get 2 decent cups, and then 2/3's of a cup of "dregs" -- drank after,
> and tending to be dusty and tannic. Also, I would have to use at least
> 2.5 teaspoons of tea, and I would rather not waste tea.
>
> So... is it simply enough to "cover" the tea leaves with water
> (ignoring the ones that float to the top)? Keep in mind that when I
> re-steep and the leaves are already wet and engorged, the water level
> still rises above the level of the leaves. So should I be concerned
> about the gravity aspect? Is it simply enough for there to be lots of
> water space around the sides, on the inside of the pot?
>
> Would appreciate any advice on this subject. Thanking you all in
> advance for your sinentic wisdom...
>

I keep two pots and two infusers. Me no have to think.

A Chatsford (for smaller volumes, they come in several sizes) and a standard
store-bought one quart porcelain pot and a large "Swiss gold tea filter"
(from Stash) for larger volumes.

Warren

> wrote in message
oups.com...
> Hello,
>
> I have recently gotten back into tea after a several-year teabag hiatus
> (due to laziness). I was really irritated at how tinny my tea tasted
> from the tea ball, and I tried those do-it-yourself tea bags with loose
> leaf tea, but the space was simply too cramped (esp. if brewing more
> than one cup at a time).
>
> Anyway, I recently bought the Teeli infuser basket (medium size) and
> had been brewing cup-by-cup (6 oz teacup). Results: excellent. The
> problems began when I wanted to make tea for my girlfriend as well,
> i.e. 2 cups at a time.
>
> So I went out and bought a 2-cup teapot (although in reality it holds
> 16 oz, which is like 2 and 2/3 cups). The infuser almost fits into it,
> though to push it all the way in requires some flex of the plastic
> frame. In a way, that is excellent in its own right because it produces
> a fairly tight seal to keep the heat in while brewing -- and I use the
> Teeli infusers little black lid during the brewing process.
>
> Now, the problem is this: if I actually use 2 and 2/3 teacups' worth of
> water (i.e. 16 oz, approx 500 mL), then the water level comes almost
> all the way up the mesh of the infuser. That's great. However, I
> usually want to brew EXACTLY 2 cups' worth, i.e. 12 oz. If I pour in
> only 12 oz. of water, the water definitely rises above the height of
> the *dry* leaves, but the level is a little over an inch (1 1/8") shy
> of the full height of the infuser basket: about 3 cm to be exact.
>
> So my question is this: assuming I use about 2 tsp worth of dry leaf,
> and the water level not only covers the dry leaf, but rises a bit more
> than halfway up the infuser, is that enough space and is that a proper
> spatial configuration for a proper infusion? I'm sort of ignorant of
> the technical and scientific aspects of it.
>
> My observations are that when I brew in a single-cup with the infuser,
> and fill the water almost all the way to the top, the leaves are
> usually lurking around at the bottom anyway (for black teas). So it
> shouldn't make too much difference in the 2-cup pot, when there isn't
> a lot of water *on top* of the leaves. Presumably in the pot since
> there is much more space *around* (i.e. outside the infuser basket to
> the sides), that the flavours and chemical goodies of the tea infuse
> outward that way.
>
> But I am concerned about green teas. Greens usually seem to have a much
> higher proportion of leaves that float to the top of the infuser
> basket, whether I fill it up all the way, or halfway. Also, the
> unfurled leaf sizes in greens tend to be enormous (I am using sencha
> and gyokuro, mainly). So I am worried that with 2 tsps my teeli infuser
> is over-matched in that specific pot.
>
> Of course the easiest thing to do to ease my mind is just to fill the
> pot nearly all the way, which means 16 oz. But I really don't want to
> get 2 decent cups, and then 2/3's of a cup of "dregs" -- drank after,
> and tending to be dusty and tannic. Also, I would have to use at least
> 2.5 teaspoons of tea, and I would rather not waste tea.
>
> So... is it simply enough to "cover" the tea leaves with water
> (ignoring the ones that float to the top)? Keep in mind that when I
> re-steep and the leaves are already wet and engorged, the water level
> still rises above the level of the leaves. So should I be concerned
> about the gravity aspect? Is it simply enough for there to be lots of
> water space around the sides, on the inside of the pot?
>
> Would appreciate any advice on this subject. Thanking you all in
> advance for your sinentic wisdom...
>

On 18 Dec 2004 23:11:35 -0800, wrote:

> Would appreciate any advice on this subject. Thanking you all in
> advance for your sinentic wisdom...

You don't have to fill the infuser for best effect.

I used to use a Teeli infuser with mugs of tea. The infuser stood a
couple of inches above the top of the mug. I simply poured in as much
water as the mug would hold.

Now days, I use something different. But I almost always make it
double strength and then dilute it before serving.

I think your concerns may have gotten the best of you. If the tea
tastes good to you, you're doing it right.

--
Derek

It's difficult to comprehend how insane some people can be.
Especially when you're insane.

Wow, my head is spinning. Here's what you need to do to make tea. G

1. Get a tea pot
2. Dump some tea leaves in it
3. Pour boiling water in it, wait a while then drink it.

I've found that this method works best for me.

wrote:

> Hello,
>
> I have recently gotten back into tea after a several-year teabag hiatus
> (due to laziness). I was really irritated at how tinny my tea tasted
> from the tea ball, and I tried those do-it-yourself tea bags with loose
> leaf tea, but the space was simply too cramped (esp. if brewing more
> than one cup at a time).
>
> Anyway, I recently bought the Teeli infuser basket (medium size) and
> had been brewing cup-by-cup (6 oz teacup). Results: excellent. The
> problems began when I wanted to make tea for my girlfriend as well,
> i.e. 2 cups at a time.
>
> So I went out and bought a 2-cup teapot (although in reality it holds
> 16 oz, which is like 2 and 2/3 cups). The infuser almost fits into it,
> though to push it all the way in requires some flex of the plastic
> frame. In a way, that is excellent in its own right because it produces
> a fairly tight seal to keep the heat in while brewing -- and I use the
> Teeli infusers little black lid during the brewing process.
>
> Now, the problem is this: if I actually use 2 and 2/3 teacups' worth of
> water (i.e. 16 oz, approx 500 mL), then the water level comes almost
> all the way up the mesh of the infuser. That's great. However, I
> usually want to brew EXACTLY 2 cups' worth, i.e. 12 oz. If I pour in
> only 12 oz. of water, the water definitely rises above the height of
> the *dry* leaves, but the level is a little over an inch (1 1/8") shy
> of the full height of the infuser basket: about 3 cm to be exact.
>
> So my question is this: assuming I use about 2 tsp worth of dry leaf,
> and the water level not only covers the dry leaf, but rises a bit more
> than halfway up the infuser, is that enough space and is that a proper
> spatial configuration for a proper infusion? I'm sort of ignorant of
> the technical and scientific aspects of it.
>
> My observations are that when I brew in a single-cup with the infuser,
> and fill the water almost all the way to the top, the leaves are
> usually lurking around at the bottom anyway (for black teas). So it
> shouldn't make too much difference in the 2-cup pot, when there isn't
> a lot of water *on top* of the leaves. Presumably in the pot since
> there is much more space *around* (i.e. outside the infuser basket to
> the sides), that the flavours and chemical goodies of the tea infuse
> outward that way.
>
> But I am concerned about green teas. Greens usually seem to have a much
> higher proportion of leaves that float to the top of the infuser
> basket, whether I fill it up all the way, or halfway. Also, the
> unfurled leaf sizes in greens tend to be enormous (I am using sencha
> and gyokuro, mainly). So I am worried that with 2 tsps my teeli infuser
> is over-matched in that specific pot.
>
> Of course the easiest thing to do to ease my mind is just to fill the
> pot nearly all the way, which means 16 oz. But I really don't want to
> get 2 decent cups, and then 2/3's of a cup of "dregs" -- drank after,
> and tending to be dusty and tannic. Also, I would have to use at least
> 2.5 teaspoons of tea, and I would rather not waste tea.
>
> So... is it simply enough to "cover" the tea leaves with water
> (ignoring the ones that float to the top)? Keep in mind that when I
> re-steep and the leaves are already wet and engorged, the water level
> still rises above the level of the leaves. So should I be concerned
> about the gravity aspect? Is it simply enough for there to be lots of
> water space around the sides, on the inside of the pot?
>
> Would appreciate any advice on this subject. Thanking you all in
> advance for your sinentic wisdom...

Wow, my head is spinning. Here's what you need to do to make tea. G

1. Get a tea pot
2. Dump some tea leaves in it
3. Pour boiling water in it, wait a while then drink it.

I've found that this method works best for me.

wrote:

> Hello,
>
> I have recently gotten back into tea after a several-year teabag hiatus
> (due to laziness). I was really irritated at how tinny my tea tasted
> from the tea ball, and I tried those do-it-yourself tea bags with loose
> leaf tea, but the space was simply too cramped (esp. if brewing more
> than one cup at a time).
>
> Anyway, I recently bought the Teeli infuser basket (medium size) and
> had been brewing cup-by-cup (6 oz teacup). Results: excellent. The
> problems began when I wanted to make tea for my girlfriend as well,
> i.e. 2 cups at a time.
>
> So I went out and bought a 2-cup teapot (although in reality it holds
> 16 oz, which is like 2 and 2/3 cups). The infuser almost fits into it,
> though to push it all the way in requires some flex of the plastic
> frame. In a way, that is excellent in its own right because it produces
> a fairly tight seal to keep the heat in while brewing -- and I use the
> Teeli infusers little black lid during the brewing process.
>
> Now, the problem is this: if I actually use 2 and 2/3 teacups' worth of
> water (i.e. 16 oz, approx 500 mL), then the water level comes almost
> all the way up the mesh of the infuser. That's great. However, I
> usually want to brew EXACTLY 2 cups' worth, i.e. 12 oz. If I pour in
> only 12 oz. of water, the water definitely rises above the height of
> the *dry* leaves, but the level is a little over an inch (1 1/8") shy
> of the full height of the infuser basket: about 3 cm to be exact.
>
> So my question is this: assuming I use about 2 tsp worth of dry leaf,
> and the water level not only covers the dry leaf, but rises a bit more
> than halfway up the infuser, is that enough space and is that a proper
> spatial configuration for a proper infusion? I'm sort of ignorant of
> the technical and scientific aspects of it.
>
> My observations are that when I brew in a single-cup with the infuser,
> and fill the water almost all the way to the top, the leaves are
> usually lurking around at the bottom anyway (for black teas). So it
> shouldn't make too much difference in the 2-cup pot, when there isn't
> a lot of water *on top* of the leaves. Presumably in the pot since
> there is much more space *around* (i.e. outside the infuser basket to
> the sides), that the flavours and chemical goodies of the tea infuse
> outward that way.
>
> But I am concerned about green teas. Greens usually seem to have a much
> higher proportion of leaves that float to the top of the infuser
> basket, whether I fill it up all the way, or halfway. Also, the
> unfurled leaf sizes in greens tend to be enormous (I am using sencha
> and gyokuro, mainly). So I am worried that with 2 tsps my teeli infuser
> is over-matched in that specific pot.
>
> Of course the easiest thing to do to ease my mind is just to fill the
> pot nearly all the way, which means 16 oz. But I really don't want to
> get 2 decent cups, and then 2/3's of a cup of "dregs" -- drank after,
> and tending to be dusty and tannic. Also, I would have to use at least
> 2.5 teaspoons of tea, and I would rather not waste tea.
>
> So... is it simply enough to "cover" the tea leaves with water
> (ignoring the ones that float to the top)? Keep in mind that when I
> re-steep and the leaves are already wet and engorged, the water level
> still rises above the level of the leaves. So should I be concerned
> about the gravity aspect? Is it simply enough for there to be lots of
> water space around the sides, on the inside of the pot?
>
> Would appreciate any advice on this subject. Thanking you all in
> advance for your sinentic wisdom...

Well, I must admit I am surprised at some of the sarcastic replies.
Especially when this newsgroup very often contains long threads about
how to calibrate thermometers to within 0.1 degrees for ideal brewing
of rare green teas.

Thank you Warren and Derek, though.

Maybe my post was too long to read and turned a lot of people off, so
here's a quick summary:

When using an infuser basket, is it ideal to have the water level so
high that the entire basket is filled to the brim, or is it simply
enough to make sure that the tea leaves themselves are covered in water
(excluding the ones that float, which will always float no matter how
high the water level is)?

That's the main issue. The space for the leaves to unfurl and be
exposed to water does not change with the water level since that's a
function of the infuser dimensions. The only difference here is that
there isn't that much water *on top* of the leaves -- but so what?
Should that really make a difference?

I'm hoping someone who knows about this sort of stuff will post a
sincere reply. I'll continue to experiment, but it would be nice to
hear some sort of authoritative answer based on science (or something
approaching that).

Well, I must admit I am surprised at some of the sarcastic replies.
Especially when this newsgroup very often contains long threads about
how to calibrate thermometers to within 0.1 degrees for ideal brewing
of rare green teas.

Thank you Warren and Derek, though.

Maybe my post was too long to read and turned a lot of people off, so
here's a quick summary:

When using an infuser basket, is it ideal to have the water level so
high that the entire basket is filled to the brim, or is it simply
enough to make sure that the tea leaves themselves are covered in water
(excluding the ones that float, which will always float no matter how
high the water level is)?

That's the main issue. The space for the leaves to unfurl and be
exposed to water does not change with the water level since that's a
function of the infuser dimensions. The only difference here is that
there isn't that much water *on top* of the leaves -- but so what?
Should that really make a difference?

I'm hoping someone who knows about this sort of stuff will post a
sincere reply. I'll continue to experiment, but it would be nice to
hear some sort of authoritative answer based on science (or something
approaching that).

>When using an infuser basket, is it ideal to have the water level so
>high that the entire basket is filled to the brim, or is it simply
>enough to make sure that the tea leaves themselves are covered in water
>(excluding the ones that float, which will always float no matter how
>high the water level is)?

I would say that you need 2-3 times the height of the expanded leaf.
If you barely cover the leaf I suspect that it will not get as
thorough of an extraction. The leaf needs to move freely and not be
encumbered. This is based on experience not science.

>The space for the leaves to unfurl and be
>exposed to water does not change with the water level since that's a
>function of the infuser dimensions.

I disagree here. The "effective" volume of the infuser basket is
limited to the height of the water, any infuser volume above the water
line is irrelevant. The volume for the leaf to expand "freely" is a
function of V = H x PI x (r x r) If you have a 3 inch diameter
infuser basket and fill it one inch with water you will give the leaf
7 cubic inches of space to expand. If you use the same 3 inch diameter
infuser and fill it up 4 inches with water you will give the leaf 28
cubic inches of volume to expand.

>The only difference here is that
>there isn't that much water *on top* of the leaves -- but so what?
>Should that really make a difference?

It has been my "unscientific" understanding that the more room that
you allow the leaf to swim the happier the leaf is. I am sure that
there has got to be a practical limit here but I would allow at least
2-3 times the volume of the unfurled leaf.



Mike Petro
http://www.pu-erh.net
remove the "filter" in my email address to reply

>When using an infuser basket, is it ideal to have the water level so
>high that the entire basket is filled to the brim, or is it simply
>enough to make sure that the tea leaves themselves are covered in water
>(excluding the ones that float, which will always float no matter how
>high the water level is)?

I would say that you need 2-3 times the height of the expanded leaf.
If you barely cover the leaf I suspect that it will not get as
thorough of an extraction. The leaf needs to move freely and not be
encumbered. This is based on experience not science.

>The space for the leaves to unfurl and be
>exposed to water does not change with the water level since that's a
>function of the infuser dimensions.

I disagree here. The "effective" volume of the infuser basket is
limited to the height of the water, any infuser volume above the water
line is irrelevant. The volume for the leaf to expand "freely" is a
function of V = H x PI x (r x r) If you have a 3 inch diameter
infuser basket and fill it one inch with water you will give the leaf
7 cubic inches of space to expand. If you use the same 3 inch diameter
infuser and fill it up 4 inches with water you will give the leaf 28
cubic inches of volume to expand.

>The only difference here is that
>there isn't that much water *on top* of the leaves -- but so what?
>Should that really make a difference?

It has been my "unscientific" understanding that the more room that
you allow the leaf to swim the happier the leaf is. I am sure that
there has got to be a practical limit here but I would allow at least
2-3 times the volume of the unfurled leaf.



Mike Petro
http://www.pu-erh.net
remove the "filter" in my email address to reply

Thanks Mike, for that reply. I

Now, I agree with what you say in part. Clearly I don't believe that
the volume of the infuser makes any difference -- it's the volume of
the water-filled part of the infuser that is important. But... and
here's what I was trying to say... when I fill the infuser in a teaCUP,
the water goes all the way to the top, however, the leaves are
basically at the bottom. Yes, they are unfurling, and they are using up
some of the volume given to them, i.e. they expand and when I'm done
infusing I note that they have expanded to maybe 3 or 4 times their dry
volume depending on leaf type. However, they obviously don't expand all
the way to the top of the infuser.

In the teaPOT, I am unable to fill the infuser all the way to the top.
However, there is about 3/4" of water above where the leaves are. I am
not "limiting" their space to expand in this way, because even with
more water, they would be settled at the bottom. My question only had
to do with whether the amount of water ABOVE the leaves allows them to
infuse faster or better or whatever. The actual expansion of the leaves
is by no means restrained (except perhaps for the most LARGE leaf
greens, like gunpowder pellets or pearls).

Does that make any sense? You still may be right, but I just wanted to
be clear.

To sum it all up, imagine that the leaves will expand to volume X. In
my tea-cup, they do this near the bottom of the teacup, because the
infuser extends all the way to the bottom. In my tea-pot, they do this
sort of suspended in the center of the water space, or maybe slightly
above the center. But their unfurled volume is clearly the same. I
think.

Thanks Mike, for that reply. I

Now, I agree with what you say in part. Clearly I don't believe that
the volume of the infuser makes any difference -- it's the volume of
the water-filled part of the infuser that is important. But... and
here's what I was trying to say... when I fill the infuser in a teaCUP,
the water goes all the way to the top, however, the leaves are
basically at the bottom. Yes, they are unfurling, and they are using up
some of the volume given to them, i.e. they expand and when I'm done
infusing I note that they have expanded to maybe 3 or 4 times their dry
volume depending on leaf type. However, they obviously don't expand all
the way to the top of the infuser.

In the teaPOT, I am unable to fill the infuser all the way to the top.
However, there is about 3/4" of water above where the leaves are. I am
not "limiting" their space to expand in this way, because even with
more water, they would be settled at the bottom. My question only had
to do with whether the amount of water ABOVE the leaves allows them to
infuse faster or better or whatever. The actual expansion of the leaves
is by no means restrained (except perhaps for the most LARGE leaf
greens, like gunpowder pellets or pearls).

Does that make any sense? You still may be right, but I just wanted to
be clear.

To sum it all up, imagine that the leaves will expand to volume X. In
my tea-cup, they do this near the bottom of the teacup, because the
infuser extends all the way to the bottom. In my tea-pot, they do this
sort of suspended in the center of the water space, or maybe slightly
above the center. But their unfurled volume is clearly the same. I
think.

On 19 Dec 2004 11:10:05 -0800, wrote:

> Well, I must admit I am surprised at some of the sarcastic replies.
> Especially when this newsgroup very often contains long threads about
> how to calibrate thermometers to within 0.1 degrees for ideal brewing
> of rare green teas.

Eh. People can be cranky around the holidays.

> Thank you Warren and Derek, though.

You're welcome.

> Maybe my post was too long to read and turned a lot of people off, so
> here's a quick summary:
>
> When using an infuser basket, is it ideal to have the water level so
> high that the entire basket is filled to the brim, or is it simply
> enough to make sure that the tea leaves themselves are covered in water
> (excluding the ones that float, which will always float no matter how
> high the water level is)?

It is ideal to ensure that your infuser basket and steeping vessel are
large enough that the leaves are still covered in water after steeping
and unfurling.

That may or may not be at the brim of the basket. But it's certainly
more than just barely covering the dry leaves at the beginning.

> That's the main issue. The space for the leaves to unfurl and be
> exposed to water does not change with the water level since that's a
> function of the infuser dimensions. The only difference here is that
> there isn't that much water *on top* of the leaves -- but so what?
> Should that really make a difference?

I think you've erred in your geometry.

The relative volume of the cylinder of the infuser basket will indeed
increase as you raise the water level relative to the basket. However,
the ultimate measure is not the level of water relative to the basket,
but the level of water relative to the leaves after they've unfurled.

> I'm hoping someone who knows about this sort of stuff will post a
> sincere reply. I'll continue to experiment, but it would be nice to
> hear some sort of authoritative answer based on science (or something
> approaching that).

If one wished to be a real snob about it, one would not use an infuser
at all. One would use two pots and a strainer. Steeping occurs in the
first pot, which would then be poured through the strainer into the
serving pot. The leaves have the total capacity of the steeping pot to
expand and float.

Personally, 90% of the time, I'm using a contraption from Taiwan that
steeps the tea in a upper compartment, and strains the tea into the
lower compartment at the touch of a button. No fuss, no worry.

I also have 3 pots, which hardly get used by comparison.

--
Derek

"If I couldn't laugh, I couldn't stand this job for 15 minutes." --
President Abraham Lincoln

On 19 Dec 2004 11:10:05 -0800, wrote:

> Well, I must admit I am surprised at some of the sarcastic replies.
> Especially when this newsgroup very often contains long threads about
> how to calibrate thermometers to within 0.1 degrees for ideal brewing
> of rare green teas.

Eh. People can be cranky around the holidays.

> Thank you Warren and Derek, though.

You're welcome.

> Maybe my post was too long to read and turned a lot of people off, so
> here's a quick summary:
>
> When using an infuser basket, is it ideal to have the water level so
> high that the entire basket is filled to the brim, or is it simply
> enough to make sure that the tea leaves themselves are covered in water
> (excluding the ones that float, which will always float no matter how
> high the water level is)?

It is ideal to ensure that your infuser basket and steeping vessel are
large enough that the leaves are still covered in water after steeping
and unfurling.

That may or may not be at the brim of the basket. But it's certainly
more than just barely covering the dry leaves at the beginning.

> That's the main issue. The space for the leaves to unfurl and be
> exposed to water does not change with the water level since that's a
> function of the infuser dimensions. The only difference here is that
> there isn't that much water *on top* of the leaves -- but so what?
> Should that really make a difference?

I think you've erred in your geometry.

The relative volume of the cylinder of the infuser basket will indeed
increase as you raise the water level relative to the basket. However,
the ultimate measure is not the level of water relative to the basket,
but the level of water relative to the leaves after they've unfurled.

> I'm hoping someone who knows about this sort of stuff will post a
> sincere reply. I'll continue to experiment, but it would be nice to
> hear some sort of authoritative answer based on science (or something
> approaching that).

If one wished to be a real snob about it, one would not use an infuser
at all. One would use two pots and a strainer. Steeping occurs in the
first pot, which would then be poured through the strainer into the
serving pot. The leaves have the total capacity of the steeping pot to
expand and float.

Personally, 90% of the time, I'm using a contraption from Taiwan that
steeps the tea in a upper compartment, and strains the tea into the
lower compartment at the touch of a button. No fuss, no worry.

I also have 3 pots, which hardly get used by comparison.

--
Derek

"If I couldn't laugh, I couldn't stand this job for 15 minutes." --
President Abraham Lincoln

Thank you again, Derek. I think you've answered my question.

I see that I misled two people so far by a carelessly worded statement
in my second post on this thread. Yes, I *do* realize that the relative
volume of the cylinder increases as the water level increases, i.e.,
any amount of non-water-filled volume is really not applicable to the
equation. But I was sort of taking for granted that the water would
still cover the unfurled leaves, and that the leaves tend to sink to
the bottom anyway.

So, yes, the water does cover my leaves even after they have unfurled,
so I should be ok I guess.

As for snobbery: I find the two-pot method to be very inexact. I can't
pour that fast anyway, so inevitably the liquid that comes out at the
end of the pour will be more tannic and strong -- the dregs, so to
speak. With an infuser basket you can instantly remove the leaves from
the water, which is much better in my opinion. Of course, the dust and
micro-particles still stick around and do their thing, but it's a
better way to do things.

I have to grant that the maximal space in the two pot method is the
ultimate in "leaf comfort", but it probably doesn't make much
difference once you get to a certain size of infuser basket (i.e. not a
tea ball). Different story for gung fu, though, where you have such a
large quantity of leaf that it would fill up an infuser like a squashed
sponge....

Thank you again, Derek. I think you've answered my question.

I see that I misled two people so far by a carelessly worded statement
in my second post on this thread. Yes, I *do* realize that the relative
volume of the cylinder increases as the water level increases, i.e.,
any amount of non-water-filled volume is really not applicable to the
equation. But I was sort of taking for granted that the water would
still cover the unfurled leaves, and that the leaves tend to sink to
the bottom anyway.

So, yes, the water does cover my leaves even after they have unfurled,
so I should be ok I guess.

As for snobbery: I find the two-pot method to be very inexact. I can't
pour that fast anyway, so inevitably the liquid that comes out at the
end of the pour will be more tannic and strong -- the dregs, so to
speak. With an infuser basket you can instantly remove the leaves from
the water, which is much better in my opinion. Of course, the dust and
micro-particles still stick around and do their thing, but it's a
better way to do things.

I have to grant that the maximal space in the two pot method is the
ultimate in "leaf comfort", but it probably doesn't make much
difference once you get to a certain size of infuser basket (i.e. not a
tea ball). Different story for gung fu, though, where you have such a
large quantity of leaf that it would fill up an infuser like a squashed
sponge....

I see why my earlier post caused confusion -- I said the water level is
irrelevant, and the volume was a function of infuser dimensions. What I
meant was that it was a function of the infuser's sideways dimensions
(PI r^2) as that is the constraining factor (because I was assuming
that I had at least enough water in the vertical dimension for the
leaves to expand and still be covered in water).

I see why my earlier post caused confusion -- I said the water level is
irrelevant, and the volume was a function of infuser dimensions. What I
meant was that it was a function of the infuser's sideways dimensions
(PI r^2) as that is the constraining factor (because I was assuming
that I had at least enough water in the vertical dimension for the
leaves to expand and still be covered in water).

On 19 Dec 2004 16:50:16 -0800, wrote:

> I see why my earlier post caused confusion -- I said the water level is
> irrelevant, and the volume was a function of infuser dimensions. What I
> meant was that it was a function of the infuser's sideways dimensions
> (PI r^2) as that is the constraining factor (because I was assuming
> that I had at least enough water in the vertical dimension for the
> leaves to expand and still be covered in water).

What? You expected us to read your mind and understand that? Maybe in
uk.rec.psychic, but not rec.food.drink.tea.

--
Derek

Sometimes the end doesn't justify the jeans.

On 19 Dec 2004 16:50:16 -0800, wrote:

> I see why my earlier post caused confusion -- I said the water level is
> irrelevant, and the volume was a function of infuser dimensions. What I
> meant was that it was a function of the infuser's sideways dimensions
> (PI r^2) as that is the constraining factor (because I was assuming
> that I had at least enough water in the vertical dimension for the
> leaves to expand and still be covered in water).

What? You expected us to read your mind and understand that? Maybe in
uk.rec.psychic, but not rec.food.drink.tea.

--
Derek

Sometimes the end doesn't justify the jeans.

Once again my standard is to allow at least 2-3 times the volume of
the fully expanded leaf. Personally I don't use infuser baskets
anyway. I prefer to allow unrestricted movement of the leaf and full
contact with as much of the water as possible. I recommend the
ingenuiTEA teapot, it allows full contact and makes all of that
infuser debate unnecessary.
https://www.adagio.com/teaware/ingen...982 307ced4d5



On 19 Dec 2004 13:19:18 -0800, cast caution to the
wind and posted:

>Thanks Mike, for that reply. I
>
>Now, I agree with what you say in part. Clearly I don't believe that
>the volume of the infuser makes any difference -- it's the volume of
>the water-filled part of the infuser that is important. But... and
>here's what I was trying to say... when I fill the infuser in a teaCUP,
>the water goes all the way to the top, however, the leaves are
>basically at the bottom. Yes, they are unfurling, and they are using up
>some of the volume given to them, i.e. they expand and when I'm done
>infusing I note that they have expanded to maybe 3 or 4 times their dry
>volume depending on leaf type. However, they obviously don't expand all
>the way to the top of the infuser.
>
>In the teaPOT, I am unable to fill the infuser all the way to the top.
>However, there is about 3/4" of water above where the leaves are. I am
>not "limiting" their space to expand in this way, because even with
>more water, they would be settled at the bottom. My question only had
>to do with whether the amount of water ABOVE the leaves allows them to
>infuse faster or better or whatever. The actual expansion of the leaves
>is by no means restrained (except perhaps for the most LARGE leaf
>greens, like gunpowder pellets or pearls).
>
>Does that make any sense? You still may be right, but I just wanted to
>be clear.
>
>To sum it all up, imagine that the leaves will expand to volume X. In
>my tea-cup, they do this near the bottom of the teacup, because the
>infuser extends all the way to the bottom. In my tea-pot, they do this
>sort of suspended in the center of the water space, or maybe slightly
>above the center. But their unfurled volume is clearly the same. I
>think.


Mike Petro
http://www.pu-erh.net
remove the "filter" in my email address to reply

In article > (Sun, 19 Dec 2004
22:40:04 -0500), Mike Petro wrote:

> Personally I don't use infuser baskets anyway. I prefer to allow
> unrestricted movement of the leaf and full contact with as much of
> the water as possible.

If the water isn't moving, does it really make a difference?

> I recommend the ingenuiTEA teapot, it allows full contact and makes all
> of that infuser debate unnecessary.
> https://www.adagio.com/teaware/ingen...982 307ced4d5

I have a Teeli "pot-size" basket I use in a 12-ounce mug. The ingenuiTEA
is quote a nice looking gadget, but is it that much different from an
infuser basket?

wrote:
> Well, I must admit I am surprised at some of the sarcastic
> replies.
[snip]
> When using an infuser basket, is it ideal...

This is the point you're missing. Infusers baskets are a
compromise, a convenience. If you want ideal, use a tea pot,
like most of the tea drinking world does. If you prepare more
than one serving at a time, brew the tea in the pot you heated
the water in, and then strain into a tea pot. Either way, only
one tea pot is needed.

--crymad

I'm sorry -- you said brew the tea in the pot you heated the water in?

Do you mean I should boil the water and then infuse the leaves in some
sort of pan? I use a kettle, like most people, to heat the water. The
two-pot method I know about boils the water in a kettle, pours over the
leaves in the brewing pot, then strains the liquid (immediately once
it's done) into the serving pot. I don't mind needing two pots, it's
all the fussing about making sure that both are warmed and such that
would start to grate on the nerves.

You're right about infuser baskets being a compromise. But given what
has been discussed here so far, I think I will use my basket when I'm
brewing Assam (and posibly Darjeeling), but not for some of the
larger-leafed Chinese blacks and certainly not for most greens. It
turns out to not be that much of a hassle to clean out the pot anyway
-- I've made a special straining contraption out of a large yogurt
container with holes cut into the bottom with an exacto knife.

I just dump the leaves after a few rinses into that container which
fits perfectly over my sink hole -- I leave it there, and in about ten
minutes the water has drained off. If I had one of those fancy sinks
with a garbage disposal unit built-in, I wouldn't have to do that.

Alright Mike, now there is no more ambiguity. 2-3 times the volume of
the *expanded* leaf. Well, I think I have about 2 times the volume for
Assam, but not for greens, so I will vary my method depending upon the
tea. Thanks.

I had seen that ingenuitea pot. It certainly makes brewing easier, but
I have read some of the reviews at that site and some say that there is
a price to pay -- cleanup is even more irritating than when using a
regular pot with loose leaves in it.

Hi crymad

This thing really is easy to use. It is also a rather clever
contraption. I have been using these things for about 3 years now and
I still love them. It is my method of choice when not using a Yixing
pot and the Gongfu method.

There is a fine mesh screen covering the entire bottom of the
contraption . There is also a valve that keeps the tea in the
contraption until you place it on a cup. When you place it on a cup
the valve will open and the tea liquor will exit the bottom of the
contraption into the cup. This action basically ensures that all of
the water passes over all of the leaves. The contraption's valve will
not open on level surface, it only opens when placed over the rim of a
cup.

Look here to see a photo of the it in action, this site calls it an
"Abid" but it is the exact same device, same price too.

http://store1.yimg.com/I/sufitea_1816_1175602
http://store.yahoo.com/sufitea/seglinbyje.html




On Sun, 19 Dec 2004 23:38:34 -0800, crymad >
cast caution to the wind and posted:

>
>
>Mike Petro wrote:
>
>> I recommend the ingenuiTEA teapot, it allows full contact and
>> makes all of that infuser debate unnecessary.
>> https://www.adagio.com/teaware/ingen...982 307ced4d5
>>
>Does the picture here show the complete setup? It just looks
>like an acrylic mug to me. Where is the tea brewed and where is
>the strainer?
>
>--crymad


Mike Petro
http://www.pu-erh.net
remove the "filter" in my email address to reply

Hi Hamilcar

To me this device is closer to a true teapot process. I say this
because in a teapot you throw the leaves in and they are free to do
whatever they want to. There can indeed be activity in the steeping
phase, the Chinese call it the "agony of the leaf" which you can see
on select greens when brewed in a clear vessel. The tea moves not the
water. Most infusers that I have seen restrict the leaf somewhat,
particularly if you barely cover the leaf with water as the original
poster implied.



On Sun, 19 Dec 2004 23:39:05 -0700, Hamilcar Barca
> cast caution to the wind and posted:

>In article > (Sun, 19 Dec 2004
>22:40:04 -0500), Mike Petro wrote:
>
>> Personally I don't use infuser baskets anyway. I prefer to allow
>> unrestricted movement of the leaf and full contact with as much of
>> the water as possible.
>
>If the water isn't moving, does it really make a difference?
>
>> I recommend the ingenuiTEA teapot, it allows full contact and makes all
>> of that infuser debate unnecessary.
>> https://www.adagio.com/teaware/ingen...982 307ced4d5
>
>I have a Teeli "pot-size" basket I use in a 12-ounce mug. The ingenuiTEA
>is quote a nice looking gadget, but is it that much different from an
>infuser basket?


Mike Petro
http://www.pu-erh.net
remove the "filter" in my email address to reply

I haven't found cleanup to be that bad, however I took the lid off of
mine.

MIkw

On 20 Dec 2004 03:15:21 -0800, cast caution to the
wind and posted:

>Alright Mike, now there is no more ambiguity. 2-3 times the volume of
>the *expanded* leaf. Well, I think I have about 2 times the volume for
>Assam, but not for greens, so I will vary my method depending upon the
>tea. Thanks.
>
>I had seen that ingenuitea pot. It certainly makes brewing easier, but
>I have read some of the reviews at that site and some say that there is
>a price to pay -- cleanup is even more irritating than when using a
>regular pot with loose leaves in it.

12/19/04


> wrote:
>> Now, the problem is this: if I actually use 2 and 2/3 teacups'
>> worth of water (i.e. 16 oz, approx 500 mL), then the water
>> level comes almost all the way up the mesh of the infuser.
>> That's great. However, I usually want to brew EXACTLY 2 cups'
>> worth, i.e. 12 oz. If I pour in only 12 oz. of water, the
>> water definitely rises above the height of the *dry* leaves,
>> but the level is a little over an inch (1 1/8") shy of the
>> full height of the infuser basket: about 3 cm to be exact.
>
> Good god, man, tea isn't this complicated. Just get a small tea
> pot or a Japanese kyuusu. Maybe a mesh strainer for when you
> pour into the cups. That's it, that's all you need.
>
> --crymad


Crymad,

Can I impose upon your good nature, and that of your wife, and ask the full
meaning of the word "kyuusu"? I thought it was a word reserved for those
side handle things -- so the geisha can serve us without intrusion -- but
others it to be a thoroughly generic Japanese word for teapot. So, who's
right here? The extension questions: What is the Japanese word for
"teapot," and what is the Japanese word for side handled teapot?

Michael

12/19/04


> wrote:
>> Now, the problem is this: if I actually use 2 and 2/3 teacups'
>> worth of water (i.e. 16 oz, approx 500 mL), then the water
>> level comes almost all the way up the mesh of the infuser.
>> That's great. However, I usually want to brew EXACTLY 2 cups'
>> worth, i.e. 12 oz. If I pour in only 12 oz. of water, the
>> water definitely rises above the height of the *dry* leaves,
>> but the level is a little over an inch (1 1/8") shy of the
>> full height of the infuser basket: about 3 cm to be exact.
>
> Good god, man, tea isn't this complicated. Just get a small tea
> pot or a Japanese kyuusu. Maybe a mesh strainer for when you
> pour into the cups. That's it, that's all you need.
>
> --crymad


Crymad,

Can I impose upon your good nature, and that of your wife, and ask the full
meaning of the word "kyuusu"? I thought it was a word reserved for those
side handle things -- so the geisha can serve us without intrusion -- but
others it to be a thoroughly generic Japanese word for teapot. So, who's
right here? The extension questions: What is the Japanese word for
"teapot," and what is the Japanese word for side handled teapot?

Michael

12/19/
04

> Well, I must admit I am surprised at some of the sarcastic replies.
> Especially when this newsgroup very often contains long threads about
> how to calibrate thermometers to within 0.1 degrees for ideal brewing
> of rare green teas.
>
> Thank you Warren and Derek, though.
>
> Maybe my post was too long to read and turned a lot of people off, so
> here's a quick summary:
>
> When using an infuser basket, is it ideal to have the water level so
> high that the entire basket is filled to the brim, or is it simply
> enough to make sure that the tea leaves themselves are covered in water
> (excluding the ones that float, which will always float no matter how
> high the water level is)?

It is probably best to let the leaves swim and float as freely as possible,
which is why I favor putting the leaves directly into the pot and using a
strainer when the tea is decanted into another vessel. If you want to avoid
the mess of leaves in the pot, use a nice deep infuser basket. Chatsforth
teapots come with them.
>
> That's the main issue. The space for the leaves to unfurl and be
> exposed to water does not change with the water level since that's a
> function of the infuser dimensions. The only difference here is that
> there isn't that much water *on top* of the leaves -- but so what?
> Should that really make a difference?

Since the leaves expand, make sure there is at least enough water to
maintain coverage, as it were. Get a pot that yields the amount of tea you
want.
>
> I'm hoping someone who knows about this sort of stuff will post a
> sincere reply. I'll continue to experiment, but it would be nice to
> hear some sort of authoritative answer based on science (or something
> approaching that).

I use a thermometer, a gram scale accurate to a tenth of a gram, and teas
that are worth the trouble. Your orginal post was kind of long, and you
imbedded your question in the middle, so I skipped over it. Ultimately,
those who advised you to simplify were speaking honestly. My advise, for
what it's worth, is to put the leaves directly into the pot. I do think it
yields a better result, and it allows you to enjoy the beauty of the leaves
dancing in the waster, which, to me, counts for a lot.

Michael
>

12/19/
04

> Well, I must admit I am surprised at some of the sarcastic replies.
> Especially when this newsgroup very often contains long threads about
> how to calibrate thermometers to within 0.1 degrees for ideal brewing
> of rare green teas.
>
> Thank you Warren and Derek, though.
>
> Maybe my post was too long to read and turned a lot of people off, so
> here's a quick summary:
>
> When using an infuser basket, is it ideal to have the water level so
> high that the entire basket is filled to the brim, or is it simply
> enough to make sure that the tea leaves themselves are covered in water
> (excluding the ones that float, which will always float no matter how
> high the water level is)?

It is probably best to let the leaves swim and float as freely as possible,
which is why I favor putting the leaves directly into the pot and using a
strainer when the tea is decanted into another vessel. If you want to avoid
the mess of leaves in the pot, use a nice deep infuser basket. Chatsforth
teapots come with them.
>
> That's the main issue. The space for the leaves to unfurl and be
> exposed to water does not change with the water level since that's a
> function of the infuser dimensions. The only difference here is that
> there isn't that much water *on top* of the leaves -- but so what?
> Should that really make a difference?

Since the leaves expand, make sure there is at least enough water to
maintain coverage, as it were. Get a pot that yields the amount of tea you
want.
>
> I'm hoping someone who knows about this sort of stuff will post a
> sincere reply. I'll continue to experiment, but it would be nice to
> hear some sort of authoritative answer based on science (or something
> approaching that).

I use a thermometer, a gram scale accurate to a tenth of a gram, and teas
that are worth the trouble. Your orginal post was kind of long, and you
imbedded your question in the middle, so I skipped over it. Ultimately,
those who advised you to simplify were speaking honestly. My advise, for
what it's worth, is to put the leaves directly into the pot. I do think it
yields a better result, and it allows you to enjoy the beauty of the leaves
dancing in the waster, which, to me, counts for a lot.

Michael
>

Ultimately, I think it's mostly an aesthetic judgement, the most important
kind. BTW, are you in Ireland? If so, I envy you. If not, where might you
be?

Michael


12/19
/04

> Thanks Mike, for that reply. I
>
> Now, I agree with what you say in part. Clearly I don't believe that
> the volume of the infuser makes any difference -- it's the volume of
> the water-filled part of the infuser that is important. But... and
> here's what I was trying to say... when I fill the infuser in a teaCUP,
> the water goes all the way to the top, however, the leaves are
> basically at the bottom. Yes, they are unfurling, and they are using up
> some of the volume given to them, i.e. they expand and when I'm done
> infusing I note that they have expanded to maybe 3 or 4 times their dry
> volume depending on leaf type. However, they obviously don't expand all
> the way to the top of the infuser.
>
> In the teaPOT, I am unable to fill the infuser all the way to the top.
> However, there is about 3/4" of water above where the leaves are. I am
> not "limiting" their space to expand in this way, because even with
> more water, they would be settled at the bottom. My question only had
> to do with whether the amount of water ABOVE the leaves allows them to
> infuse faster or better or whatever. The actual expansion of the leaves
> is by no means restrained (except perhaps for the most LARGE leaf
> greens, like gunpowder pellets or pearls).
>
> Does that make any sense? You still may be right, but I just wanted to
> be clear.
>
> To sum it all up, imagine that the leaves will expand to volume X. In
> my tea-cup, they do this near the bottom of the teacup, because the
> infuser extends all the way to the bottom. In my tea-pot, they do this
> sort of suspended in the center of the water space, or maybe slightly
> above the center. But their unfurled volume is clearly the same. I
> think.
>

wrote:
> I'm sorry -- you said brew the tea in the pot you heated the
> water in?
>
> Do you mean I should boil the water and then infuse the leaves
> in some sort of pan? I use a kettle, like most people, to
> heat the water.

Not a saute pan, though I guess in a pinch it would work. Yes, I
brew tea in the pot the water is heated in. By "pot", I mean a small
saucepan, 1 liter or less. Heat water in this, toss in leaves,
then strain into some other vessel, be it a cup or a teapot. I
don't use a kettle, because I often use a thermometer to measure
water temperature, and a kettle doesn't allow easy access to the
water with the probe. Even when I don't use a thermometer,
estimating the temperature is easier in a pot, where the bubbles are
visible. I don't always use a pot for brewing -- Japanese greens
I brew in a small teapot. Even then, I heat the water in a pot,
because accurate temperature measurement is crucial.

At someplace without a burner and metal pot, just use a microwave
and a Pyrex liquid measuring cup. Check temperature if necessary,
and stir in dry leaf. Strain into cup, and that's it.

--crymad

wrote:
> I'm sorry -- you said brew the tea in the pot you heated the
> water in?
>
> Do you mean I should boil the water and then infuse the leaves
> in some sort of pan? I use a kettle, like most people, to
> heat the water.

Not a saute pan, though I guess in a pinch it would work. Yes, I
brew tea in the pot the water is heated in. By "pot", I mean a small
saucepan, 1 liter or less. Heat water in this, toss in leaves,
then strain into some other vessel, be it a cup or a teapot. I
don't use a kettle, because I often use a thermometer to measure
water temperature, and a kettle doesn't allow easy access to the
water with the probe. Even when I don't use a thermometer,
estimating the temperature is easier in a pot, where the bubbles are
visible. I don't always use a pot for brewing -- Japanese greens
I brew in a small teapot. Even then, I heat the water in a pot,
because accurate temperature measurement is crucial.

At someplace without a burner and metal pot, just use a microwave
and a Pyrex liquid measuring cup. Check temperature if necessary,
and stir in dry leaf. Strain into cup, and that's it.

--crymad

Must water be heated in a separate vessel and poured into the
top part with the tea leaves?

I'm sure it has its charms, but when away from home, I'll stick
with the Pyrex and strainer method I mentioned in another post.

--crymad


Mike Petro wrote:
> Hi crymad
>
> This thing really is easy to use. It is also a rather clever
> contraption.
>
> Look here to see a photo of the it in action, this site calls
> it an "Abid" but it is the exact same device, same price too.
>
>
> http://store1.yimg.com/I/sufitea_1816_1175602
> http://store.yahoo.com/sufitea/seglinbyje.html

Michael Plant wrote:
>
> Can I impose upon your good nature, and that of your wife, and
> ask the full meaning of the word "kyuusu"? I thought it was
> a word reserved for those side handle things -- so the geisha
> can serve us without intrusion -- but others it to be a
> thoroughly generic Japanese word for teapot. So, who's right
> here? The extension questions: What is the Japanese word for
> "teapot," and what is the Japanese word for side handled
> teapot?

Actually, "kyuusu" can have handles on the side or across the
top. So it's just a generic word for teapot, albeit in a
Japanese style, and usually smaller than typical western ones.
Small teapots from China or Korea would be called "kyuusu" as
well, though. Japanese would call an English teapot a "teapot",
or, more phonetically, "tei-potto".

--crymad

Michael Plant wrote:
>
> Can I impose upon your good nature, and that of your wife, and
> ask the full meaning of the word "kyuusu"? I thought it was
> a word reserved for those side handle things -- so the geisha
> can serve us without intrusion -- but others it to be a
> thoroughly generic Japanese word for teapot. So, who's right
> here? The extension questions: What is the Japanese word for
> "teapot," and what is the Japanese word for side handled
> teapot?

Actually, "kyuusu" can have handles on the side or across the
top. So it's just a generic word for teapot, albeit in a
Japanese style, and usually smaller than typical western ones.
Small teapots from China or Korea would be called "kyuusu" as
well, though. Japanese would call an English teapot a "teapot",
or, more phonetically, "tei-potto".

--crymad