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| Tea (rec.drink.tea) Discussion relating to tea, the world's second most consumed beverage (after water), made by infusing or boiling the leaves of the tea plant (C. sinensis or close relatives) in water. |
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How to measure tea
I see in the FAQ that there are several suggestions for measuring tea:
1. 1 tsp per person + 1 tsp for the pot. This seems problematic. I bought some tea samples and they vary considerably in how dense they are. 2. 1 tsp for anywhere from 5.5 oz to 16 oz of water. Again, this is a large range. 3. 15 g per liter of water. This translates to about 2.66 g for a 6-oz cup or about 10.65 g for a 4-cup pot. A local tea shop has a handout that gives the amount of tea by weight for a 4-cup pot. Most of the teas call for 6 g / pot, with a few calling for 7 or 8. The herbals are more, up to 10 g / pot. Browing the Upton site, I check 10-15 teas including blacks, oolongs, and greens and they all caleld for 2 1/4 g/cup. If they mean a 6 oz cup, that would be 10 g for a 24 oz (4 cup) pot. If they mean an 8 oz cup, that would be 7.5 g for a 24 oz pot. I have a scale with an accuracy of 1g. I usually use a 4-cup (24 oz) pot. How much tea should I use by weight in grams? -- Email: Usenet-20031220 at spamex.com (11/09/04) |
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My general rule of thumb is 1g for every 2oz of water, but then I like
my tea a little on the strong side. I also ONLY steep for 3 minutes to avoid harshness. This yields a good cup to my tastes. Mike http://www.pu-erh.net On Fri, 28 Jan 2005 00:29:53 -0800, Top Spin > cast caution to the wind and posted: >I see in the FAQ that there are several suggestions for measuring tea: > >1. 1 tsp per person + 1 tsp for the pot. This seems problematic. I >bought some tea samples and they vary considerably in how dense they >are. > >2. 1 tsp for anywhere from 5.5 oz to 16 oz of water. Again, this is a >large range. > >3. 15 g per liter of water. This translates to about 2.66 g for a 6-oz >cup or about 10.65 g for a 4-cup pot. > >A local tea shop has a handout that gives the amount of tea by weight >for a 4-cup pot. Most of the teas call for 6 g / pot, with a few >calling for 7 or 8. The herbals are more, up to 10 g / pot. > >Browing the Upton site, I check 10-15 teas including blacks, oolongs, >and greens and they all caleld for 2 1/4 g/cup. If they mean a 6 oz >cup, that would be 10 g for a 24 oz (4 cup) pot. If they mean an 8 oz >cup, that would be 7.5 g for a 24 oz pot. > >I have a scale with an accuracy of 1g. I usually use a 4-cup (24 oz) >pot. How much tea should I use by weight in grams? Mike Petro http://www.pu-erh.net remove the "filter" in my email address to reply |
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My rule of thumb know your pot, know your tea, and know your tastebuds.
If the tea taste strong then more water or less tea, if weak less water or more tea. Some people add temperature and a timer to the mix. I just use boiling water and wait. I use a 1 liter pot for all teas and I eyeball the amount from previous experience which might be a pinch more for this and less for that. I use that figuratively, pinch your tea for measurement of larger grades and palm for the smaller. If you're a neophyte start with some recommended calculations then throw away the sliderule when you realize your tastebuds are the only ones that count. Brewing tea is an art form and not a science project. My latest version of judging the perfect cuppa is waiting for the leaves to look just right in the pot. Jim Top Spin wrote: > I see in the FAQ that there are several suggestions for measuring tea: > > 1. 1 tsp per person + 1 tsp for the pot. This seems problematic. I > bought some tea samples and they vary considerably in how dense they > are. > > 2. 1 tsp for anywhere from 5.5 oz to 16 oz of water. Again, this is a > large range. > > 3. 15 g per liter of water. This translates to about 2.66 g for a 6-oz > cup or about 10.65 g for a 4-cup pot. > > A local tea shop has a handout that gives the amount of tea by weight > for a 4-cup pot. Most of the teas call for 6 g / pot, with a few > calling for 7 or 8. The herbals are more, up to 10 g / pot. > > Browing the Upton site, I check 10-15 teas including blacks, oolongs, > and greens and they all caleld for 2 1/4 g/cup. If they mean a 6 oz > cup, that would be 10 g for a 24 oz (4 cup) pot. If they mean an 8 oz > cup, that would be 7.5 g for a 24 oz pot. > > I have a scale with an accuracy of 1g. I usually use a 4-cup (24 oz) > pot. How much tea should I use by weight in grams? > > -- > Email: Usenet-20031220 at spamex.com > (11/09/04) |
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On 28 Jan 2005 09:41:45 -0800, "Space Cowboy" >
wrote: >My rule of thumb know your pot, know your tea, and know your tastebuds. >If the tea taste strong then more water or less tea, if weak less >water or more tea. Some people add temperature and a timer to the mix. >I just use boiling water and wait. I use a 1 liter pot for all teas >and I eyeball the amount from previous experience which might be a >pinch more for this and less for that. I use that figuratively, pinch >your tea for measurement of larger grades and palm for the smaller. If >you're a neophyte start with some recommended calculations then throw >away the sliderule when you realize your tastebuds are the only ones >that count. Brewing tea is an art form and not a science project. My >latest version of judging the perfect cuppa is waiting for the leaves >to look just right in the pot. In the end, you are, of course, right. However, for an inexperienced tea drinker, it is helpful to know how tea is supposed to taste. For me, and I imagine many people, tea is an aquired taste. I first tried it 20-30 years ago and did not like it at all. That might have been because it was not good tea, not well prepared, etc. I have returned to it in the last few years mainly because of health reasons. I am finding that there are so many variables, that I would like to try and get a handle on the way most people brew their tea. I will then have to try various combinations within those ranges and then make my own choices. But it helps to have some general recommendations from those with more experience. I'd just like to start my experimenting somewhere in the "typical" range. Thanks -- Email: Usenet-20031220 at spamex.com (11/09/04) |
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By health reasons, I am guessing that you are more interested in greens. If
that is the case, the two most important things I think relate to getting a (more) acceptable taste out of greens for the western/new palate a Never use boiling water for greens and don't steep too long. What's too long? This Christmas I received two greens which were brand new to me from Holy Mountain as a gift from my sweetie. I had no prior experience with these greens or ones quite like them, so my start was to use a teaspoon a cup (heaping somewhat since they were twisty) and steeping them, in a glass mason jar, at water around 170 (I am tending to use cooler than the usually recommended 180 because I find 180 to bring out too much harshness too soon...at least in the case of greens other than my run of the mill gunpowder, which...I don't care about it's bitterness since I mix it with mint). I steeped the first tea (huang shan mao feng) for around 30 seconds but found (to my memory..I could have the time wrong) that it wasn't very strong. The next steep of those leaves I increased the time but not the temp. It's touchy sometimes and depends on at what point your tastebuds say the drink has become too bitter or astringent. For instance, some on here love sencha (Japanese green) but I have been finding it too astringent for me most of the time, so I prefer Chinese greens at this point. My point is, each tea is actually pretty different and a 20-30 second oversteep CAN make something pass into the realm of bitterness. I have found that if I get a sample of a green I use the cooler water (even 165 or some say 150) and then I taste it as it steeps and decant when I feel it's reached where I want it. I like getting larger amounts of greens though so I can have that tea over a period of time and get to know it better. But the cooler water seems to let me get a handle on the new tea quicker than it would if I were steeping at a higher one. My thought is make sure you start with water at most at 170. Unless it's a more delicate green (gyokuro or something) in which case...150-160? (comments on this from those who drink it more often welcome). Hope this helps somewhat. Melinda > > In the end, you are, of course, right. However, for an inexperienced > tea drinker, it is helpful to know how tea is supposed to taste. > > For me, and I imagine many people, tea is an aquired taste. I first > tried it 20-30 years ago and did not like it at all. That might have > been because it was not good tea, not well prepared, etc. > > I have returned to it in the last few years mainly because of health > reasons. I am finding that there are so many variables, that I would > like to try and get a handle on the way most people brew their tea. I > will then have to try various combinations within those ranges and > then make my own choices. > > But it helps to have some general recommendations from those with more > experience. I'd just like to start my experimenting somewhere in the > "typical" range. > > Thanks > > > -- > Email: Usenet-20031220 at spamex.com > (11/09/04) |
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In article >,
Mike Petro > wrote: > My general rule of thumb is 1g for every 2oz of water, but then I like > my tea a little on the strong side. I also ONLY steep for 3 minutes to > avoid harshness. This yields a good cup to my tastes. anything over 3 minutes is adding only astringency. all the flavor is in the water by 3 minutes......pilo* |
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"Top Spin" > wrote in message ... > I see in the FAQ that there are several suggestions for measuring tea: > > 1. 1 tsp per person + 1 tsp for the pot. 1 for the pot is an old wives' tale, I suspect started by those who like a stiff brew. > Browing the Upton site, I check 10-15 teas including blacks, oolongs, > and greens and they all caleld for 2 1/4 g/cup. If they mean a 6 oz > cup, Yes, Upton adheres to the tea standard of a 6 oz. cup. I don't know where it is on the website, if present, but it is stated in the hard-copy catalog. > I have a scale with an accuracy of 1g. I usually use a 4-cup (24 oz) > pot. How much tea should I use by weight in grams? Start out w/ 2 g per 6 oz cup. Modify from there to suit your personal taste after you gain experience with a tea. For example, for most teas for me, I figure per 8 oz, but others, I figure per 6 oz. -- ~~Bluesea~~ Spam is great in musubi but not in email. Please take out the trash before sending a direct reply. |
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Bluesea wrote:
> 1 for the pot is an old wives' tale, I suspect started by those who like a > stiff brew. > ... > Start out w/ 2 g per 6 oz cup. The pejorative seems gratuitous. OWT implies myth. One per cup plus one for the pot is a valid cultural preference, common in the UK and especially in the cold north. Since tea there is often brewed in what most of us would consider large pots, the "extra" measure might not make much difference to taste. I'm going to hazard a guess that it evolved as a gesture of generosity - since tea doesn't pile evenly, and can easily slip out of a measuring spoon in the source tin, the extra shows good intention toward guests. Also, since the unit of measure is a teaspoon, 2g is about right. So what's the gripe? My mother's family is from Yorkshire, and that's the way we always had it. I also saw it done that way routinely during the several years I spent in the UK. Hardly an OWT. -DM |
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"Dog Ma 1" (reply w/o spam)> wrote in message ... > Bluesea wrote: > > 1 for the pot is an old wives' tale, I suspect started by those who like a > > stiff brew. > > ... > > Start out w/ 2 g per 6 oz cup. > > The pejorative seems gratuitous. OWT implies myth. One per cup plus one for > the pot is a valid cultural preference, common in the UK and especially in > the cold north. Since tea there is often brewed in what most of us would > consider large pots, the "extra" measure might not make much difference to > taste. I'm going to hazard a guess that it evolved as a gesture of > generosity - since tea doesn't pile evenly, and can easily slip out of a > measuring spoon in the source tin, the extra shows good intention toward > guests. > > Also, since the unit of measure is a teaspoon, 2g is about right. So what's > the gripe? > > My mother's family is from Yorkshire, and that's the way we always had it. I > also saw it done that way routinely during the several years I spent in the > UK. Hardly an OWT. I'm sorry that you took it in a manner that I didn't intend. My point was that some instruct to add extra tea that isn't necessary - that those who instruct to do so are carrying on a tradition from "those who like a stiff brew" which is *exactly* what I said. What I didn't say was I've been told that the pot absorbs an amount of tea so great as to require an extra teaspoon - that part *is* an OWT especially for modern glazed, glass, or metal pots. If the OP starts out w/ 2g per cup and finds that a stiffer brew is preferred, by all means "add one for the pot." I'm not against regional tastes, tradition, or personal preference; just nonsensical rationale for doing things. There was no gripe, no pejorative intended. I hope this clears up any misunderstanding. -- ~~Bluesea~~ Spam is great in musubi but not in email. Please take out the trash before sending a direct reply. |
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On Fri, 28 Jan 2005 15:26:46 -0800, "Melinda" >
wrote: >By health reasons, I am guessing that you are more interested in greens. In one sense, yes. But I have found that a pot of (any) tea over an afternoon will keep me from snacking. So I am experimenting with greens, blacks, and oolongs. It sounds like I need to do some experimenting. I have never tried a temperature as low as 170, let alone 150, or a time under 2 minutes, let alone 30 seconds. >If >that is the case, the two most important things I think relate to getting a >(more) acceptable taste out of greens for the western/new palate a > >Never use boiling water for greens > >and > >don't steep too long. > >What's too long? This Christmas I received two greens which were brand new >to me from Holy Mountain as a gift from my sweetie. I had no prior >experience with these greens or ones quite like them, so my start was to use >a teaspoon a cup (heaping somewhat since they were twisty) and steeping >them, in a glass mason jar, at water around 170 (I am tending to use cooler >than the usually recommended 180 because I find 180 to bring out too much >harshness too soon...at least in the case of greens other than my run of the >mill gunpowder, which...I don't care about it's bitterness since I mix it >with mint). I steeped the first tea (huang shan mao feng) for around 30 >seconds but found (to my memory..I could have the time wrong) that it wasn't >very strong. The next steep of those leaves I increased the time but not the >temp. It's touchy sometimes and depends on at what point your tastebuds say >the drink has become too bitter or astringent. For instance, some on here >love sencha (Japanese green) but I have been finding it too astringent for >me most of the time, so I prefer Chinese greens at this point. > >My point is, each tea is actually pretty different and a 20-30 second >oversteep CAN make something pass into the realm of bitterness. I have found >that if I get a sample of a green I use the cooler water (even 165 or some >say 150) and then I taste it as it steeps and decant when I feel it's >reached where I want it. I like getting larger amounts of greens though so I >can have that tea over a period of time and get to know it better. But the >cooler water seems to let me get a handle on the new tea quicker than it >would if I were steeping at a higher one. My thought is make sure you start >with water at most at 170. Unless it's a more delicate green (gyokuro or >something) in which case...150-160? (comments on this from those who drink >it more often welcome). > >Hope this helps somewhat. > >Melinda >> >> In the end, you are, of course, right. However, for an inexperienced >> tea drinker, it is helpful to know how tea is supposed to taste. >> >> For me, and I imagine many people, tea is an aquired taste. I first >> tried it 20-30 years ago and did not like it at all. That might have >> been because it was not good tea, not well prepared, etc. >> >> I have returned to it in the last few years mainly because of health >> reasons. I am finding that there are so many variables, that I would >> like to try and get a handle on the way most people brew their tea. I >> will then have to try various combinations within those ranges and >> then make my own choices. >> >> But it helps to have some general recommendations from those with more >> experience. I'd just like to start my experimenting somewhere in the >> "typical" range. >> >> Thanks >> >> >> -- >> Email: Usenet-20031220 at spamex.com >> (11/09/04) > -- Email: Usenet-20031220 at spamex.com (11/09/04) |
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On Fri, 28 Jan 2005 06:50:26 -0500, Mike Petro >
wrote: >My general rule of thumb is 1g for every 2oz of water, but then I like >my tea a little on the strong side. I also ONLY steep for 3 minutes to >avoid harshness. This yields a good cup to my tastes. From the reading I have been doing, that is a little more tea/cup than most. Upton recommends 2 1/4 g/cup or about 9 grams/4-cup pot (24 oz). My local tea shop recommends anywhere from 6 to 10 grams/pot (24 oz). The blacks are mostly 6, the oolongs mostly 7-8, the greens mostly 6, and the herbals as much as 10. Most sources seem to agree with your advice to keep the steeping time constant and vary the amount of tea. I have some experimenting to do. Thanks -- Email: Usenet-20031220 at spamex.com (11/09/04) |
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"Top Spin" > wrote in message ... > On Fri, 28 Jan 2005 12:15:25 GMT, Michael Plant > > wrote: > > >Red Tea > >One third as many grams of tea as there are ounces of water > >or slightly more. > > What's a red tea? I found several refernces in the FAQ to teas that > have a red liquor, but no red tea. China black a.k.a. China Congou a.k.a. red tea. > >Oolong Tea (assuming Gungfu) > >Twice as many grams of tea as there are ounces of water > > Wow. I don't know what Gungfu is. Also not in the FAQ. But that's a > lot of tea -- as much as 6 times as much as most recommendations. Yes, it's in the FAQ although spelled as "gongfu": http://pages.ripco.net/~c4ha2na9/tea/faq.html#3.1.2. -- ~~Bluesea~~ Spam is great in musubi but not in email. Please take out the trash before sending a direct reply. |
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On Mon, 31 Jan 2005 05:30:23 GMT, "Bluesea"
> wrote: > >"Top Spin" > wrote in message .. . >> On Fri, 28 Jan 2005 12:15:25 GMT, Michael Plant > >> wrote: >> >> >Red Tea >> >One third as many grams of tea as there are ounces of water >> >or slightly more. >> >> What's a red tea? I found several refernces in the FAQ to teas that >> have a red liquor, but no red tea. > >China black a.k.a. China Congou a.k.a. red tea. OK, thanks >> >Oolong Tea (assuming Gungfu) >> >Twice as many grams of tea as there are ounces of water >> >> Wow. I don't know what Gungfu is. Also not in the FAQ. But that's a >> lot of tea -- as much as 6 times as much as most recommendations. > >Yes, it's in the FAQ although spelled as "gongfu": > >http://pages.ripco.net/~c4ha2na9/tea/faq.html#3.1.2. Got it. I also found some descriptions through Google (could have done that before ;-) ). Now I see why such a high volume of tea leaves. It's interesting that they use boiling water but green or oolong tea. I have seen several warnings against water that is too hot for greens and even for oolongs. Is it the very brief infusion that keeps it from being bitter? -- Email: Usenet-20031220 at spamex.com (11/09/04) |
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"Top Spin" > wrote in message news  > > It's interesting that they use boiling water but green or oolong tea. > I have seen several warnings against water that is too hot for greens > and even for oolongs. And for whites. Water that's too hot brings out the astringency in the not-black teas which is nice to know if a tea seems harsh. It's possible to smooth it down, sometimes to quite an extent, by lowering the temperature. Also, while the standard recommendation for the not-black teas is 180F or lower, Japanese greens seem to do better at 170F and below. > Is it the very brief infusion that keeps it from being bitter? I don't know. Before last week, I would have said "yes." But, then I ran across http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tannin#Tea that states that green tea does not release tannins. FWIW, I typically brew my greens and whites for 2-1/2 min. and my blacks for 2 to 4 min. depending on what it is. -- ~~Bluesea~~ Spam is great in musubi but not in email. Please take out the trash before sending a direct reply. |
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Doesn't anyone do this with greens 'cept me? I know I read someone on here
saying something about that, it's where I got the idea....in fact I seem to remember reading someone somewhere (may have been another list) saying they would try steeping greens at room temp water for a long time. Melinda -- "The country has entered an era in which questions are not asked, for questions are daughters of disquiet or arrogance, both fruits of temptation and the food of sacrilege." Djaout "Michael Plant" > wrote in message ... > 1/28/05 > > >> In article >, >> Mike Petro > wrote: >> >>> My general rule of thumb is 1g for every 2oz of water, but then I like >>> my tea a little on the strong side. I also ONLY steep for 3 minutes to >>> avoid harshness. This yields a good cup to my tastes. >> >> anything over 3 minutes is adding only astringency. >> all the flavor is in the water by 3 minutes......pilo* > > Can't entirely agree here, out of my experience. A lower temperature will > bring the flavors to the water more slowly. Using Mike's formula at > temperatures down to 175 allows even longer steeps without astringency. > We're talking Pu'erhs of course. > > Michael > |
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I have had it recommended to me that gongfu isn't as good to do with greens for just that reason, that the water is too hot and it stews the leaves even if done for a short time. Others have allowed that I might be able to do it using cooler water and a flatter pot (to let off the heat easier I think). When I gongfu I do oolong in my yixing and I have a very small teapot that is glazed that I do puer in, so it's not quite traditional, but I have been able in it to keep the steeps short and use a little more leaf which is what I was after. Steeping puer the "normal" way doesn't make much sense to me as I feel I have less control over the final product. There is a whole world in oolongs though, as well as each other catagory. The possibilities are endless... Melinda > > It's interesting that they use boiling water but green or oolong tea. > I have seen several warnings against water that is too hot for greens > and even for oolongs. Is it the very brief infusion that keeps it from > being bitter? > > -- > Email: Usenet-20031220 at spamex.com > (11/09/04) |
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"Melinda" > writes:
> Doesn't anyone do this with greens 'cept me? I know I read someone on here > saying something about that, it's where I got the idea....in fact I seem to > remember reading someone somewhere (may have been another list) saying they > would try steeping greens at room temp water for a long time. I do this in the summer. The flavor profile is different from brewing with heat, but not necessarily inferior: there's almost no bitterness. The texture seems different, too: almost creamy, sometimes. Way more interesting than iced tea, in my opinion. /Lew --- Lew Perin / http://www.panix.com/~perin/babelcarp.html |
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Michael Plant wrote:
> On the subject of temperature/time continuum, I often brew greens at room > temperature or close to room temperature, especially in summer for travel. > And we are *not* alone. You are quite right. > > Michael > And what would the steeping time be, then? rgds, ole k |
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Ole Kvaal > writes:
> Michael Plant wrote: > > On the subject of temperature/time continuum, I often brew greens at room > > temperature or close to room temperature, especially in summer for travel. > > And we are *not* alone. You are quite right. > > Michael > > > And what would the steeping time be, then? I use 15 minutes as a starting point. /Lew --- Lew Perin / http://www.panix.com/~perin/babelcarp.html |
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Lewis Perin wrote:
>> >>>On the subject of temperature/time continuum, I often brew greens at room >>>temperature or close to room temperature, especially in summer for travel. >>>And we are *not* alone. You are quite right. >>>Michael >>> >> >>And what would the steeping time be, then? > > > I use 15 minutes as a starting point. > Thanks a lot. I'm also curious, why do you prefer using this procedure in the summer? Is it closer to iced tea in some way, or what. ole k |
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Ole Kvaal > writes:
> Lewis Perin wrote: > >> > >>>On the subject of temperature/time continuum, I often brew greens at room > >>>temperature or close to room temperature, especially in summer for travel. > >>>And we are *not* alone. You are quite right. > >>>Michael > >> > >>And what would the steeping time be, then? > > I use 15 minutes as a starting point. > > Thanks a lot. I'm also curious, why do you prefer using this procedure > in the summer? It's simple. In the summer, I often don't feel like drinking something hot, but I really don't like iced tea because it's too cold to really taste it. > Is it closer to iced tea in some way, or what. When you brew green tea at room temperature, there's no astringency at all, which can give it an almost creamy texture. I don't find myself wanting it when the weather is cool, but try it - you might like it. /Lew --- Lew Perin / http://www.panix.com/~perin/babelcarp.html |
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Lewis Perin wrote:
> It's simple. In the summer, I often don't feel like drinking > something hot, but I really don't like iced tea because it's too cold > to really taste it. > When you brew green tea at room temperature, there's no astringency at > all, which can give it an almost creamy texture. I don't find myself > wanting it when the weather is cool, but try it - you might like it. > Thanks again. Your replies have been marked "Important" and been stored in my Thunderbird "Food and drink" search folder. :-) ole k |
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Lewis Perin wrote: > Ole Kvaal > writes: >> >> Thanks a lot. I'm also curious, why do you prefer using this >> procedure in the summer? > > > It's simple. In the summer, I often don't feel like drinking > something hot, but I really don't like iced tea because it's > too cold to really taste it. I do this "cold brewing"/"mizu-dashi" of Sencha in the summer too. Have a special cup for it too, somewhat like a small, stemless brandy snifter with a charming sky-blue floral design, straight from mid-60's Japan. I do like to put in one or two ice cubes when drinking it. Don't load it up with ice, or the tea will get too cold and the flavor will be lost. --crymad |
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That sounds lovely crymad.
 I've been using a tall narrow highball glass,I think it is, for brewing oolong cold the last few days. It certainly gives it something extra. Melinda -- "The country has entered an era in which questions are not asked, for questions are daughters of disquiet or arrogance, both fruits of temptation and the food of sacrilege." Djaout "crymad" > wrote in message ... > > I do this "cold brewing"/"mizu-dashi" of Sencha in the summer too. > Have a special cup for it too, somewhat like a small, stemless > brandy snifter with a charming sky-blue floral design, straight > from mid-60's Japan. I do like to put in one or two ice cubes > when drinking it. Don't load it up with ice, or the tea will get > too cold and the flavor will be lost. > > --crymad |
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Melinda wrote: > That sounds lovely crymad. I've been using a tall narrow> highball glass, I think it is, for brewing oolong cold the last > few days. It certainly gives it something extra. Yeah, I really like these glasses. They were dug out from a big box of dishes at my wife's grandparents' house. Given their fragility, I'm surprised they survived without breaking. --crymad |
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| how to measure splenda? | Diabetic | |||
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