I heard on NPR that as of yesterday PayPal is now open in China. This
could prove very interesting in opening the doors to small purchases
directly from smaller Chinese vendors. Previously only foreigners
living in China, or Chinese with foreign connections, had access to
Paypal. Since most Chinese did not have access to Paypal it was often
cost prohibitive to deal with the Bank Transfers, and other hoops that
you had to jump through, for just a small order. Now, as more Chinese
Vendor's get online with Paypal it could become quite simple. This
should also improve the Chinese tea quality and prices available
domestically since competition will almost certainly increase. It will
probably put an end to $5 cakes being sold for $80, for once I think
the consumer will win.

Mike
http://www.pu-erh.net

I see the negative side of it. As more vendors get online, it will be
more and more difficult to sift through all the vendors to find a good
one. It's akin to going to the tea market and taking all afternoon to
find someone that doesn't treat you like you've never drank Chinese tea
before. There's still a good chance that even the 5 dollar cakes
should only cost 1 dollar or less even at the reputable dealers sites
online.

I just rich I was rolling in the dough. I would fly you guys out to
Guangzhou, and we could spend the afternoon in Fangcun; it would be
educational beyond belief.

I see the negative side of it. As more vendors get online, it will be
more and more difficult to sift through all the vendors to find a good
one. It's akin to going to the tea market and taking all afternoon to
find someone that doesn't treat you like you've never drank Chinese tea
before. There's still a good chance that even the 5 dollar cakes
should only cost 1 dollar or less even at the reputable dealers sites
online.

I just wish I was rolling in the dough. I would fly you guys out to
Guangzhou, and we could spend the afternoon in Fangcun; it would be
educational beyond belief.

god. sorry...I hate google groups.

"Mydnight" > writes:

> god. sorry...I hate google groups.

So why don't you learn how to use it? As I've said to you offline,
you need to start quoting relevant parts of the posts you respond to.
Admittedly, Google doesn't seem to make this the default, but other
posters seem to deal with this successfully.

/Lew
---
Lew Perin /
http://www.panix.com/~perin/babelcarp.html

"Mike Petro" > wrote in news:1121177282.556391.107080
@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:

> I heard on NPR that as of yesterday PayPal is now open in China. This
> could prove very interesting in opening the doors to small purchases
> directly from smaller Chinese vendors. Previously only foreigners
> living in China, or Chinese with foreign connections, had access to
> Paypal. Since most Chinese did not have access to Paypal it was often
> cost prohibitive to deal with the Bank Transfers, and other hoops that
> you had to jump through, for just a small order. Now, as more Chinese
> Vendor's get online with Paypal it could become quite simple. This
> should also improve the Chinese tea quality and prices available
> domestically since competition will almost certainly increase. It will
> probably put an end to $5 cakes being sold for $80, for once I think
> the consumer will win.
>
> Mike
> http://www.pu-erh.net

I think that depends on the number, cost and frustration level of the
"hoops you have to jump throuigh", both for the small Chinese merchants &
their Western customers (for example, how about a "special" fee to get an
export permit, permitting a small busnessperson to tap those lucrative
overseas markets?)

Maybe consumers will benefit, though -- but I wouldn't be surprised if
they'll have to me more alert to do so.

Ozzy

I can follow the relavent threads with relative ease using the "view as
a tree" button, which I would recommend you try. I was saying that I
hate google groups because it crashes my IE and then double posts.

You're the only one that seems to have trouble following threads around
here, so I would pose the same question to you: Why don't YOU learn
how to use it?

7/12/05


> I can follow the relavent threads with relative ease using the "view as
> a tree" button, which I would recommend you try. I was saying that I
> hate google groups because it crashes my IE and then double posts.
>
> You're the only one that seems to have trouble following threads around
> here, so I would pose the same question to you: Why don't YOU learn
> how to use it?
>


Mydnight,

With all do respect, and I do respect you, the message above, as well as
your "god." message are a complete mystery to me, as many of your
decontextualized messages are. This is not criticism, but a suggestion: Add
as much of the orginal post as is necessary to make clear to what you are
referring.

I use a usenet client, not Google groups. It's clean and to the point.
Highly recommended, if possible. It's also right up to the minute, unlike
the web-based portals such as Google, etc. Perhaps in China you don't have
the same wonderful resources that glut our American life, but still and all,
context helps, however you are able to achieve it.

Michael

Mydnight > wrote:
>I can follow the relavent threads with relative ease using the "view as
>a tree" button, which I would recommend you try. I was saying that I
>hate google groups because it crashes my IE and then double posts.

Then why are you using it? If you are on Great Wall Broadband, ask if
they have a Usenet server available. I gather you are in Wuhan from your
IP address, which means you may need to talk to the headquarters guys.

If they have no news server (and nntp.gwbn.net.cn doesn't seem to resolve
for me), you can always buy a Supernews account. Getting off of Google
and onto a real news service will be a huge improvement in every possible way.

There is a free server in Changzhou at news.bentium.com, which seems to be
pretty reliable. It has a good feed, but it is set up for read-only
access. It's possible that you can get posting access through their
server for a fee.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

"Mydnight" > writes:

> I can follow the relavent threads with relative ease using the "view as
> a tree" button, which I would recommend you try.

What makes you think I read Usenet with Google Groups?

> I was saying that I hate google groups because it crashes my IE and
> then double posts.
>
> You're the only one that seems to have trouble following threads around
> here,

Rash assumption.

> so I would pose the same question to you: Why don't YOU learn
> how to use it?

Because I'm happy with the newsreader I use: Emacs/Gnus. You're
asking me to use your newsreader; I'm just asking you to learn to use
the one you already use.

/Lew
---
Lew Perin /
http://www.panix.com/~perin/babelcarp.html

Again what the hell are you talking about without telling us to climb a
tree. I use Google Groups so read the Help to find out how too include
quoted post. As far as I can tell it is the default in other words I
couldn't turn it off if I wanted too. As far as I can tell you are
deleting the quoted post specifically. The basic Usenet standard is
too include at least snippets of what you are talking about. I don't
use Google Tree View but Timeline. Several of us have complained
publicly about your lack of etiquette. Honestly sometimes I have no
clue who or what you are talking about because you are several days
behind a thread. So saw off the branch behind you. The last
newsreader I had didn't support threaded tree views.

Jim

Mydnight wrote:
> I can follow the relavent threads with relative ease using the "view as
> a tree" button, which I would recommend you try. I was saying that I
> hate google groups because it crashes my IE and then double posts.
>
> You're the only one that seems to have trouble following threads around
> here, so I would pose the same question to you: Why don't YOU learn
> how to use it?

In article >,
Michael Plant > wrote:

> I use a usenet client, not Google groups. It's clean and to the point.
> Highly recommended, if possible. It's also right up to the minute, unlike
> the web-based portals such as Google, etc. Perhaps in China you don't have
> the same wonderful resources that glut our American life, but still and all,
> context helps, however you are able to achieve it.

I am constantly amazed and infuriated by users
of Google's usenet interface. It happens in most
groups I subscribe to; you open a message, and
are confronted with, for example, ONLY these
words:

'I know. I don't happen to use them, but if I did,
I would certainly add the Barton 3 beforehand.'


It's crazy-making............................................ .p*

Hi Mike,

I do hope so, from the way I see it, the other way round seem more
possible - where small vendors jump on the bandwagon and try to reap what
the large vendors are ripping off from the online buyers. The other problem
I can see is that to made use of the Paypal advantage, a small vendor would
have to have a website, run it, and maintain it; since being net savy is
still a problem for most of these rural vendors, they would have to buy the
service of web designers, and that's added cost to them, which might
eventually add to the price of the goods.

Not to mention that these websites would probably be in Chinese, and it's
added cost to have them translated...

Danny

"Mike Petro"
Now, as more Chinese
> Vendor's get online with Paypal it could become quite simple. This
> should also improve the Chinese tea quality and prices available
> domestically since competition will almost certainly increase. It will
> probably put an end to $5 cakes being sold for $80, for once I think
> the consumer will win.

[Pilo]
> 'I know. I don't happen to use them, but if I did,
> I would certainly add the Barton 3 beforehand.'

[Michael]
The reason you are having problems is because you
are using the Barton 3, which is outdated. Switch to
the Barton 3.2 and you will be pleasantly surprised
at the difference. Performance, connectivity, and
aducatability improve immensely. Just a thought.
Hope this helps.

BTW, with the Barton 3.2, you will have no trouble
usng them. Let us know how it works out.

Best,
Michael

What's hard about filling out a Customs Declaration form and using
China Post? My latest shipment from China arrived in record time 6/23
- 7/13. Someone is now attaching my zipcode as a barcode. The last
shipment included a 100g tuocha from some factory other than Xiaguan or
Menghai. The production date was March this year. It is the most
agreeable black so far. I noticed the second infusion was almost non
existent. Which leads me to ponder are multiple infusions a sign of
aging? I think PayPal if it pans out will be a plus. They had to jump
through some International Banking regulations hoops I would guess.
There are lot of PayPal merchants who don't sell on Ebay. PayPal
should make the transaction screen available in language of choice so
you know the cost even though you don't know what you are buying in say
Chinese.

Jim

Ozzy wrote:
> "Mike Petro" > wrote in news:1121177282.556391.107080
> @g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:
>
> > I heard on NPR that as of yesterday PayPal is now open in China. This
> > could prove very interesting in opening the doors to small purchases
> > directly from smaller Chinese vendors. Previously only foreigners
> > living in China, or Chinese with foreign connections, had access to
> > Paypal. Since most Chinese did not have access to Paypal it was often
> > cost prohibitive to deal with the Bank Transfers, and other hoops that
> > you had to jump through, for just a small order. Now, as more Chinese
> > Vendor's get online with Paypal it could become quite simple. This
> > should also improve the Chinese tea quality and prices available
> > domestically since competition will almost certainly increase. It will
> > probably put an end to $5 cakes being sold for $80, for once I think
> > the consumer will win.
> >
> > Mike
> > http://www.pu-erh.net
>
> I think that depends on the number, cost and frustration level of the
> "hoops you have to jump throuigh", both for the small Chinese merchants &
> their Western customers (for example, how about a "special" fee to get an
> export permit, permitting a small busnessperson to tap those lucrative
> overseas markets?)
>
> Maybe consumers will benefit, though -- but I wouldn't be surprised if
> they'll have to me more alert to do so.
>
> Ozzy

"Space Cowboy" > wrote in
oups.com:

> What's hard about filling out a Customs Declaration form and using
> China Post? My latest shipment from China arrived in record time 6/23
> - 7/13. Someone is now attaching my zipcode as a barcode. The last
> shipment included a 100g tuocha from some factory other than Xiaguan or
> Menghai. The production date was March this year. It is the most
> agreeable black so far. I noticed the second infusion was almost non
> existent. Which leads me to ponder are multiple infusions a sign of
> aging? I think PayPal if it pans out will be a plus. They had to jump
> through some International Banking regulations hoops I would guess.
> There are lot of PayPal merchants who don't sell on Ebay. PayPal
> should make the transaction screen available in language of choice so
> you know the cost even though you don't know what you are buying in say
> Chinese.
>
> Jim
>

I'm pleased to hear that importing is so easy -- but in posting I had
pictured the small exporter having possible trouble as well (having to pay
a bribe suggested itself at once).

Still, having Paypal may possibly lead more merchants to try to export,
whatever the problems, and this *will* be good for the consumer. Maybe
more trash, but more treasure too.

Ozzy

>I can follow the relavent threads with relative ease using the "view as
>a tree" button, which I would recommend you try. I was saying that I
>hate google groups because it crashes my IE and then double posts

I don't have access to any news-servers here, and I can't find one. I
hate using google groups, and before I was using forte agent for my
browsing.

If you're using google, it's really easy to follow threads in a tree
style by doing the following:

1. Hit view full text only.
2. Hit sort by first post
3. Hit view as a tree.

Although, it sucks to use google, it's easy to follow.

We still don't know who you are talking too but probably yourself
again. It's even easier to quote posting using Google which is
compatable with all newsreaders. I like using Google without the tree.
I use it like a newsreader. I look at the latest sequential posts in
the subject and reply at will without worrying about the limb with the
ability to look at older posts with the same subject that may be
decades old. Oh yeah if you can view a tree the post is still inserted
properly.

Jim

Mydnight wrote:
> >I can follow the relavent threads with relative ease using the "view as
> >a tree" button, which I would recommend you try. I was saying that I
> >hate google groups because it crashes my IE and then double posts
>
> I don't have access to any news-servers here, and I can't find one. I
> hate using google groups, and before I was using forte agent for my
> browsing.
>
> If you're using google, it's really easy to follow threads in a tree
> style by doing the following:
>
> 1. Hit view full text only.
> 2. Hit sort by first post
> 3. Hit view as a tree.
>
> Although, it sucks to use google, it's easy to follow.

"Mydnight" > writes:

> >I can follow the relavent threads with relative ease using the "view as
> >a tree" button, which I would recommend you try. I was saying that I
> >hate google groups because it crashes my IE and then double posts
>
> I don't have access to any news-servers here, and I can't find one. I
> hate using google groups, and before I was using forte agent for my
> browsing.

Hey, you've learned how to quote with Google Groups! Thanks for this.

/Lew
---
Lew Perin /
http://www.panix.com/~perin/babelcarp.html