In article >, "Dutch" >
wrote:

> "Ron" > wrote
>
> [..]
> > IOW, we are who we are because we are individuals AND we have been
> > taught to be who we are -- a socialization process. Any argument of
> > innateness of anything requires significant evidence from my
> > perspective.
>
> Every living organism is hard-wired for survival, to avoid and recoil from
> harm. That is innate.

We disagree. That just means humans experience fear and have knowledge
about death. If you are going to claim that this is hard wired, please
describe the 'hard wiring'. Please describe the genetic sequence that
requires any of us to recoil from harm, yet to actively seek out harmful
situations contrary to our 'wiring'.

> Moral precepts, like The Golden Rule, are just ways to
> organize behaviour in an attempt to minimize harm. Moral codes are flawed
> and inconsistent, but they are all based on the fundamental inherent drive
> to avoid harm. The suggestion that they are simply random cultural artifacts
> is wrong.

LOL. That is YOUR objective and worldview. I find our culture extremely
paranoid and fearful - some moreso than others. In most cases, I find
that people tend to overestimate the degree of risk and harm that is
likely to happen.

All harm is not bad. As I stated, I consider a 'redemption philosophy'
to be wholly realistic in that many 'bad' or 'evil' things in the world
can also be demonstrated to have positive effects and outcomes.