Before we get into the topic: Ok, I am new to wine. I have been
drinking teas of varying grades for years, but recently I've been
looking into trying to learn more about wines. I've done your usual,
going to various shops; comparing prices; trying to learn the
difference between the types of grapes; etc. I have a most
interesting problem: I am living on mainland China. Concerning wine,
I have to wade knee-deep through the exact same problem that I have
with buying tea in China; uneducated but rich investors/buyers
creating a mock bull market to simply amuse themselves. With wine
it's not so serious because I just need to look in the "imported"
section and pray for the best...but there again, I recall seeing some
of the same brands in the Food-Lion here marked up 10 times.

But, I digress.

I seem to dig more spicy wines, and it seems that much comes from
South America. I've found a few Malbecs around here of unknown origin
that I think are ok, but would no doubt offend the more serious wine
drinkers here. My question is two-fold: What are some better Malbecs
I should be trying to search for and would anybody know any vendors/
shops/places online to buy wines that would be accessible from
mainland China? I am a hop away from HK, if any of you fine folks are
in HK.

Thanks, and I hope to learn much from this newsgroup as I have from
rfdt.

Mydnight wrote:
My question is two-fold: What are some better Malbecs
> I should be trying to search for and would anybody know any vendors/
> shops/places online to buy wines that would be accessible from
> mainland China? I am a hop away from HK, if any of you fine folks are
> in HK.
>
> Thanks, and I hope to learn much from this newsgroup as I have from
> rfdt.
>
In the US Argentine Malbecs are plentiful, I will hope that some of the
ones I know are found in your market. In general Argentina makes great
malbec at all price points. For French Malbec look to wines labeled "Cahors"

Forget that I present here the malbecs available at La Cabana in Buenos
Aires I have had a few and will note them, these go from expensive down
(IIRC)

Escorihuela Gascon one of my favorite $15 Malbecs
Achaval Ferrer I have seen this one in the US for $29-40
Rutini Rutini is a major player with a wide variety of price points
Alto Las Hormigas another good one
as are Norton and Terrazas

If you can't find any of these ... well, ask again!

Palo Domingo
Domingo Hnos., Yacochuya, Cafayate, Salta

Achaval Ferrer Altamira Ultra Premium
Achaval Ferrer, Finca Altamira, Mendoza


Yacochuya
San Pedro de Yacochuya, Cafayate, Salta

Angelica Zapata Alta
Fincas Catena Zapata, Agrelo, Mendoza

Val De Flores
Monteviejo, Vista Flores, Tunuyán, Mendoza

Cadus
Nieto Senetiner, Vistalba, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza

Alto Alta Vista
Alta Vista, Finca Las Compuertas, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza

Doña Paula Seleccion De Bodega
Viña Doña Paula, Ugarteche, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza

Rutini Antologia XII
Bodega La Rural, Maipú, Mendoza

Rutini
Bodega La Rural, La Consulta, San Carlos, Mendoza

LindaFlor
Bodega Monteviejo, Monteviejo, Vista Flores, Mendoza

Piedra Negra
Jacques & François Lurton, Valle de Uco, Tunuyán, Mendoza

J. Alberto
Bodega Noemía, Río Negro, Patagonia

Ruca Malén Kinien
Bodega Ruca Malén, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza

Alto Las Hormigas Reserva
Alto Las Hormigas, Las Compuertas, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza

Finca La Anita
La Anita, Alto Agrelo, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza

Historico
Finca El Plumerillo, Colonia Las Rosas, Tunuyán, Mendoza

Monteviejo
Bodega Monteviejo, Monteviejo, Vista Flores, Mendoza

Matices De Abril
Bodegas Abril, Tunuyán, Mendoza

Family Reserve
Finca La Perserverancia, San Rafael, Mendoza

Tierras Altas Malbec Crianza
Vargas Arizu, Vistalba, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza

Carmelo Patti
Finca El Lagar, Mayor Drummond, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza

Reserva
Fincas Don Martino, Mayor Drummond, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza

Laborum
Bodega El Porvenir, Valle del Cafayate, Salta
Partidas limitadas de 5.181 botellas

Domingo Molina
Domingo Hnos., Yacochuya, Cafayate, Salta

Famiglia Bianchi
Bodega Valentín Bianchi, San Rafael, Mendoza

Del Fin Del Mundo
Bodega del Fin del Mundo, San Patricio del Chañar, Neuquén

Gran Malbec. Flecha de los Andes
Bodega Flecha de los Andes, Vista Flores, Mendoza

Doña Paula Estate
Viña Doña Paula, Alto Ugarteche, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza

Saint Felicien
Bodega Catena Zapata, Agrelo, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza

Alto Las Hormigas
Alto Las Hormigas, Las Compuertas, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza

Achaval Ferrer. Malbec Mendoza
Perdriel, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza

Perdriel Coleccion Privada
Bodega Norton, Perdriel, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza

Terrazas Reserva
Terrazas de los Andes, Vistalba, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza

Obra Prima Malbec Reserva
Familia Cassone, Mayor Drummond, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza

Cinco Tierras
Bodega Banfi, Agrelo, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza

Finca Sophenia
Sophenia, Tupungato, Gualtayari, Mendoza

Luigi Bosca Reserva
Bodega Leoncio Arizu, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza

Lamarca
Bodega Lamarca, Tupungato, Mendoza

Altocedro Reserva
Vino de Autor, Santa Rosa, Mendoza

Viña Amalia
Finca La Amalia, Altamira, San Carlos, Mendoza

Terrazas
Terrazas de los Andes, Vistalba, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza

El Peral
Finca El Peral, Tupungato, Mendoza

Escorihuela Gascon
Bodegas Escorihuela, La Consulta, Vistalba y Agrelo, Mendoza

Gran Malbec
Bodega Flecha de los Andes, Vista Flores, Mendoza

Reserva Malbec
Bodega Jacques & Francois Lurton, Tunuyam, Mendoza

El Plumerillo
Finca El Plumerillo, Colonia Las Rosas, Tunuyán, Mendoza

Santa Ercilia
Bodega Nogal, Valle de Uco, Mendoza

Pascual Toso
Pascual Toso Bodegas y Viñedos, Finca Las Barrancas, Maipú, Mendoza

Fabre - Montmayou
Domaine Vistalba, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza

Martino
Fincas Don Martino, Agrelo, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza

Norton Doc
Norton, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza

On Mar 24, 5:14 am, Joseph Coulter > wrote:
> Mydnight wrote:
>
> My question is two-fold: What are some better Malbecs> I should be trying to search for and would anybody know any vendors/
> > shops/places online to buy wines that would be accessible from
> > mainland China? I am a hop away from HK, if any of you fine folks are
> > in HK.
>
> > Thanks, and I hope to learn much from this newsgroup as I have from
> > rfdt.
>
> In the US Argentine Malbecs are plentiful, I will hope that some of the
> ones I know are found in your market. In general Argentina makes great
> malbec at all price points. For French Malbec look to wines labeled "Cahors"
>
> Forget that I present here the malbecs available at La Cabana in Buenos
> Aires I have had a few and will note them, these go from expensive down
> (IIRC)
>
> Escorihuela Gascon one of my favorite $15 Malbecs
> Achaval Ferrer I have seen this one in the US for $29-40
> Rutini Rutini is a major player with a wide variety of price points
> Alto Las Hormigas another good one
> as are Norton and Terrazas
>
> If you can't find any of these ... well, ask again!
>
> Palo Domingo
> Domingo Hnos., Yacochuya, Cafayate, Salta
>
> Achaval Ferrer Altamira Ultra Premium
> Achaval Ferrer, Finca Altamira, Mendoza
>
> Yacochuya
> San Pedro de Yacochuya, Cafayate, Salta
>
> Angelica Zapata Alta
> Fincas Catena Zapata, Agrelo, Mendoza
>
> Val De Flores
> Monteviejo, Vista Flores, Tunuyán, Mendoza
>
> Cadus
> Nieto Senetiner, Vistalba, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza
>
> Alto Alta Vista
> Alta Vista, Finca Las Compuertas, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza
>
> Doña Paula Seleccion De Bodega
> Viña Doña Paula, Ugarteche, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza
>
> Rutini Antologia XII
> Bodega La Rural, Maipú, Mendoza
>
> Rutini
> Bodega La Rural, La Consulta, San Carlos, Mendoza
>
> LindaFlor
> Bodega Monteviejo, Monteviejo, Vista Flores, Mendoza
>
> Piedra Negra
> Jacques & François Lurton, Valle de Uco, Tunuyán, Mendoza
>
> J. Alberto
> Bodega Noemía, Río Negro, Patagonia
>
> Ruca Malén Kinien
> Bodega Ruca Malén, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza
>
> Alto Las Hormigas Reserva
> Alto Las Hormigas, Las Compuertas, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza
>
> Finca La Anita
> La Anita, Alto Agrelo, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza
>
> Historico
> Finca El Plumerillo, Colonia Las Rosas, Tunuyán, Mendoza
>
> Monteviejo
> Bodega Monteviejo, Monteviejo, Vista Flores, Mendoza
>
> Matices De Abril
> Bodegas Abril, Tunuyán, Mendoza
>
> Family Reserve
> Finca La Perserverancia, San Rafael, Mendoza
>
> Tierras Altas Malbec Crianza
> Vargas Arizu, Vistalba, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza
>
> Carmelo Patti
> Finca El Lagar, Mayor Drummond, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza
>
> Reserva
> Fincas Don Martino, Mayor Drummond, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza
>
> Laborum
> Bodega El Porvenir, Valle del Cafayate, Salta
> Partidas limitadas de 5.181 botellas
>
> Domingo Molina
> Domingo Hnos., Yacochuya, Cafayate, Salta
>
> Famiglia Bianchi
> Bodega Valentín Bianchi, San Rafael, Mendoza
>
> Del Fin Del Mundo
> Bodega del Fin del Mundo, San Patricio del Chañar, Neuquén
>
> Gran Malbec. Flecha de los Andes
> Bodega Flecha de los Andes, Vista Flores, Mendoza
>
> Doña Paula Estate
> Viña Doña Paula, Alto Ugarteche, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza
>
> Saint Felicien
> Bodega Catena Zapata, Agrelo, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza
>
> Alto Las Hormigas
> Alto Las Hormigas, Las Compuertas, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza
>
> Achaval Ferrer. Malbec Mendoza
> Perdriel, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza
>
> Perdriel Coleccion Privada
> Bodega Norton, Perdriel, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza
>
> Terrazas Reserva
> Terrazas de los Andes, Vistalba, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza
>
> Obra Prima Malbec Reserva
> Familia Cassone, Mayor Drummond, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza
>
> Cinco Tierras
> Bodega Banfi, Agrelo, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza
>
> Finca Sophenia
> Sophenia, Tupungato, Gualtayari, Mendoza
>
> Luigi Bosca Reserva
> Bodega Leoncio Arizu, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza
>
> Lamarca
> Bodega Lamarca, Tupungato, Mendoza
>
> Altocedro Reserva
> Vino de Autor, Santa Rosa, Mendoza
>
> Viña Amalia
> Finca La Amalia, Altamira, San Carlos, Mendoza
>
> Terrazas
> Terrazas de los Andes, Vistalba, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza
>
> El Peral
> Finca El Peral, Tupungato, Mendoza
>
> Escorihuela Gascon
> Bodegas Escorihuela, La Consulta, Vistalba y Agrelo, Mendoza
>
> Gran Malbec
> Bodega Flecha de los Andes, Vista Flores, Mendoza
>
> Reserva Malbec
> Bodega Jacques & Francois Lurton, Tunuyam, Mendoza
>
> El Plumerillo
> Finca El Plumerillo, Colonia Las Rosas, Tunuyán, Mendoza
>
> Santa Ercilia
> Bodega Nogal, Valle de Uco, Mendoza
>
> Pascual Toso
> Pascual Toso Bodegas y Viñedos, Finca Las Barrancas, Maipú, Mendoza
>
> Fabre - Montmayou
> Domaine Vistalba, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza
>
> Martino
> Fincas Don Martino, Agrelo, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza
>
> Norton Doc
> Norton, Luján de Cuyo, Mendoza


Thanks so much for your reply, and I do recognize some of those names
from the list but they aren't exactly the same. I found a Doña Paula
but it is something called Doña Paula Los Cardos. I also have some of
the Bodega Jacques Francois Lurton but it only says Valle de uco
Mendoza and nothing else. I am going to go with my original guess
when I say these are some of the lower end products of the vineyards?

You heard of these before?

The Los Cardos is acceptable, I think.

Mydnight wrote:
> On Mar 24, 5:14 am, Joseph Coulter > wrote:
>> Mydnight wrote:


>
> Thanks so much for your reply, and I do recognize some of those names
> from the list but they aren't exactly the same. I found a Doña Paula
> but it is something called Doña Paula Los Cardos. I also have some of
> the Bodega Jacques Francois Lurton but it only says Valle de uco
> Mendoza and nothing else. I am going to go with my original guess
> when I say these are some of the lower end products of the vineyards?
>
> You heard of these before?
>
> The Los Cardos is acceptable, I think.
>
It is a little hit and miss. The Escorihuela Gascon for instance is
marketed under a different name in the US as Escorihuela is just too
much for US drinkers to say (I suppose). I was trying to give an
impression of the producers because many, like Rutini, have a broad
range of wines from less expensive to costly. The producers that I have
underscored will deliver good quality in their price range.

The reason that I pasted the list from La Cabana is that it is extensive
and represents a broad sampling of wines available at a very fine
restaurant and yet many of the wines listed are affordable at US market
prices.

Joseph Coulter wrote:
> Mydnight wrote:
>> On Mar 24, 5:14 am, Joseph Coulter > wrote:
>>> Mydnight wrote:
>
>
>>
>> Thanks so much for your reply, and I do recognize some of those names
>> from the list but they aren't exactly the same. I found a Doña Paula
>> but it is something called Doña Paula Los Cardos. I also have some of
>> the Bodega Jacques Francois Lurton but it only says Valle de uco
>> Mendoza and nothing else. I am going to go with my original guess
>> when I say these are some of the lower end products of the vineyards?
>>
>> You heard of these before?
>>
>> The Los Cardos is acceptable, I think.
>>
> It is a little hit and miss. The Escorihuela Gascon for instance is
> marketed under a different name in the US as Escorihuela is just too
> much for US drinkers to say (I suppose).
FWIW the Escoriheula is called Cruz Alta in the US not to be confused
with another wine also named after Sr. Gascon.


I was trying to give an
> impression of the producers because many, like Rutini, have a broad
> range of wines from less expensive to costly. The producers that I have
> underscored will deliver good quality in their price range.
>
> The reason that I pasted the list from La Cabana is that it is extensive
> and represents a broad sampling of wines available at a very fine
> restaurant and yet many of the wines listed are affordable at US market
> prices.

In article . com>,
says...
>
>Before we get into the topic: Ok, I am new to wine. I have been
>drinking teas of varying grades for years, but recently I've been
>looking into trying to learn more about wines. I've done your usual,
>going to various shops; comparing prices; trying to learn the
>difference between the types of grapes; etc. I have a most
>interesting problem: I am living on mainland China. Concerning wine,
>I have to wade knee-deep through the exact same problem that I have
>with buying tea in China; uneducated but rich investors/buyers
>creating a mock bull market to simply amuse themselves. With wine
>it's not so serious because I just need to look in the "imported"
>section and pray for the best...but there again, I recall seeing some
>of the same brands in the Food-Lion here marked up 10 times.
>
>But, I digress.
>
>I seem to dig more spicy wines, and it seems that much comes from
>South America. I've found a few Malbecs around here of unknown origin
>that I think are ok, but would no doubt offend the more serious wine
>drinkers here. My question is two-fold: What are some better Malbecs
>I should be trying to search for and would anybody know any vendors/
>shops/places online to buy wines that would be accessible from
>mainland China? I am a hop away from HK, if any of you fine folks are
>in HK.
>
>Thanks, and I hope to learn much from this newsgroup as I have from
>rfdt.

To paraphrase the party-guest in the motion picture, "The Graduate," it's
"Mendoza," (replaces the word "plastics."). If I am seeking Malbec, I always
go to Mendoza, and am almost never disappointed. Argentina has embraced this
varietal and the Mendoza region seems to have a strangle-hold on Malbec. There
may be weak ones out there (what area of the world doesn't have a few weak
wines?), but you cut your losses by looking there.

I do not know how well they may be represented in China, but it is not a
varietal that is a darling of the collectors. It is not immune to the
problems, that you mention, but is less likely to be affected, than say a 1er
Cru Bdx, or cult Cal-Cab.

Hunt

In article >,
says...
>
>Mydnight wrote:

Joseph Coulter wrote:

[SNIP great recs.]

Joseph, what a great list. I have not experienced almost 1/2 of your list, but
will keep it handy, when going out after Malbec. If the remainder is as good,
as the ones, with which I am familiar, they should be excellent.

Only hope is that some are available to the OP.

Hunt

On Mar 26, 12:16 pm, (Hunt) wrote:
> In article >,
> says...
>
>
>
> >Mydnight wrote:
> Joseph Coulter wrote:
>
> [SNIP great recs.]
>
> Joseph, what a great list. I have not experienced almost 1/2 of your list, but
> will keep it handy, when going out after Malbec. If the remainder is as good,
> as the ones, with which I am familiar, they should be excellent.
>
> Only hope is that some are available to the OP.

As I said in an above post, I've located some of the producers like
Dona Paula, but it was not the same as he said. So far, I have not
been able to find anything on that list, and I don't plan to be able
to. Most of the vineyards, I'm finding, are shipping the lowest
quality stuff over and marking it up to take advantage of China's
uneducated wine market. The stuff I've found here has retailed in
winesearcher for like 4-8 dollars, most of it, and they sell for like
10-15.

Rather disconcerting.

Hunt wrote:
> In article >,
> says...
>> Mydnight wrote:
>
> Joseph Coulter wrote:
>
> [SNIP great recs.]
>
> Joseph, what a great list. I have not experienced almost 1/2 of your list, but
> will keep it handy, when going out after Malbec. If the remainder is as good,
> as the ones, with which I am familiar, they should be excellent.

It should be a great list, the restaurant is as good as it gets in BA,
but in keeping with Argentine spirit nothing there is over priced so one
can eat high and drink well for a song.
>

On Mar 23, 2:22 pm, "Mydnight" > wrote:
> Before we get into the topic: Ok, I am new to wine. I have been
> drinking teas of varying grades for years, but recently I've been
> looking into trying to learn more about wines. I've done your usual,
> going to various shops; comparing prices; trying to learn the
> difference between the types of grapes; etc. I have a most
> interesting problem: I am living on mainland China. Concerning wine,
> I have to wade knee-deep through the exact same problem that I have
> with buying tea in China; uneducated but rich investors/buyers
> creating a mock bull market to simply amuse themselves. With wine
> it's not so serious because I just need to look in the "imported"
> section and pray for the best...but there again, I recall seeing some
> of the same brands in the Food-Lion here marked up 10 times.
>
> But, I digress.
>
> I seem to dig more spicy wines, and it seems that much comes from
> South America. I've found a few Malbecs around here of unknown origin
> that I think are ok, but would no doubt offend the more serious wine
> drinkers here. My question is two-fold: What are some better Malbecs
> I should be trying to search for and would anybody know any vendors/
> shops/places online to buy wines that would be accessible from
> mainland China? I am a hop away from HK, if any of you fine folks are
> in HK.
>
> Thanks, and I hope to learn much from this newsgroup as I have from
> rfdt.


If you like 'spicy' wines, you may want to look into southern Italian
wines and wines from Sicily and Sardinia. Monica di Sardegna is a
particular favorite of mine.

In article .com>,
says...
>
>On Mar 26, 12:16 pm, (Hunt) wrote:
>> In article >,
>> says...
>>
>>
>>
>> >Mydnight wrote:
>> Joseph Coulter wrote:
>>
>> [SNIP great recs.]
>>
>> Joseph, what a great list. I have not experienced almost 1/2 of your list,
but
>> will keep it handy, when going out after Malbec. If the remainder is as
good,
>> as the ones, with which I am familiar, they should be excellent.
>>
>> Only hope is that some are available to the OP.
>
>As I said in an above post, I've located some of the producers like
>Dona Paula, but it was not the same as he said. So far, I have not
>been able to find anything on that list, and I don't plan to be able
>to. Most of the vineyards, I'm finding, are shipping the lowest
>quality stuff over and marking it up to take advantage of China's
>uneducated wine market. The stuff I've found here has retailed in
>winesearcher for like 4-8 dollars, most of it, and they sell for like
>10-15.
>
>Rather disconcerting.

That is a pity. With the Chinese economy doing so well, and a bit of
"globalization," I'd think that soon, this might change, and hopefully for the
better.

Hunt

> That is a pity. With the Chinese economy doing so well, and a bit of
> "globalization," I'd think that soon, this might change, and hopefully for the
> better.
>
> Hunt- Hide quoted text -



In Beijing and Shanghai you can get 2nd notch up from the worst for
double the price. I guess that's progress...of some kind.