What wine to choose
 

>>t was the '02 Huet. I bought a case just prior to my trip to Europe and was
>>pleasantly surprised to see it on the wine list.
>
>Lucky man! The '02 Huet demi-secs are getting hard to find. I had the Le Mont
>a
>few months ago, excellent (though obvious infanticide). I'm going to try and
>pick up some tonight when in city.
>
>Dale
>
To be honest it was easy to find. Here in Columbus, Ohio folks haven't caught
on to the Loire wines yet (or Alsace for that matter) so I had it at a store
tasting and bought a case. The distributor had a number of cases. FWIW, I
thought that the "demi -sec" was drier than it's sec counterpart.
Bi!!

What wine to choose
 

"Ian Hoare" > wrote

> I've not said that. I think I shall drop out of this thread, as we seem to
> be unable to find any common ground at all.

I'll take it up, if you don't mind, 'cos I've not said anything yet!

I was thinking that a Gewurtztraminer would be my wine of choice for most
curries, but then decided that it would probably be a waste, since if I'm
going to splash out (and for me, it is splashing out) on a decent G, I'd
rather save it to go with lobster or scallops - both of which I feel are
enhanced by/enhance it. Finally came to the conclusion that a nice tall
glass of weak lime cordial would suit most curries (and if you want alcohol,
you can always chuck a vodka in it and call it a cocktail!). There used to
be a soft drink mixer called 'Russchian' or similar, the taste of which
would enhance most curries, although being fizzy it would probably hurt my
chilli-sensitized tongue! That's why I'm not keen on lager or cider as
curry-side drinks - the bubbles hurt! The suggestion someone made of iced
tea appeals, too.

None of which would help an Italian-style starter, so I'm no nearer helping
the OP. I'm a bit of a purist when it comes to mixing cuisines across
courses - I don't do it, 'cos I like my dinner parties to have a theme (and
it makes things like deciding on drinks so much simpler!).

Jo


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What wine to choose
 

"Ian Hoare" > wrote

> I've not said that. I think I shall drop out of this thread, as we seem to
> be unable to find any common ground at all.

I'll take it up, if you don't mind, 'cos I've not said anything yet!

I was thinking that a Gewurtztraminer would be my wine of choice for most
curries, but then decided that it would probably be a waste, since if I'm
going to splash out (and for me, it is splashing out) on a decent G, I'd
rather save it to go with lobster or scallops - both of which I feel are
enhanced by/enhance it. Finally came to the conclusion that a nice tall
glass of weak lime cordial would suit most curries (and if you want alcohol,
you can always chuck a vodka in it and call it a cocktail!). There used to
be a soft drink mixer called 'Russchian' or similar, the taste of which
would enhance most curries, although being fizzy it would probably hurt my
chilli-sensitized tongue! That's why I'm not keen on lager or cider as
curry-side drinks - the bubbles hurt! The suggestion someone made of iced
tea appeals, too.

None of which would help an Italian-style starter, so I'm no nearer helping
the OP. I'm a bit of a purist when it comes to mixing cuisines across
courses - I don't do it, 'cos I like my dinner parties to have a theme (and
it makes things like deciding on drinks so much simpler!).

Jo


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What wine to choose
 

Salut/Hi Darkginger,

le/on Sat, 10 Jul 2004 10:06:55 +0100, tu disais/you said:-

>
>"Ian Hoare" > wrote
>
>> I've not said that. I think I shall drop out of this thread, as we seem to
>> be unable to find any common ground at all.
>
>I'll take it up, if you don't mind, 'cos I've not said anything yet!

Don't mind at all. It was just that Bruce seemed to be getting more and more
ratty, so I thought it best to stop.

>(and for me, it is splashing out) on a decent G, I'd rather save it to go with lobster or scallops - both of which I feel are enhanced by/enhance it.

sorry, Can't agree, as I find that both are rather dominated by the powerful
monolithic character of the grape. Have you had a good Alsace Riesing with
these? They are often cheaper. Another possibility in a similar kind of mold
might be a Pinot Gris.

> Finally came to the conclusion that a nice tall glass of weak lime cordial would suit most curries (and if you want alcohol, >you can always chuck a vodka in it and call it a cocktail!).

Interesting suggestion.

>None of which would help an Italian-style starter, so I'm no nearer helping
>the OP.

You're right that the subject has deviated a bit. It's normal.

> I'm a bit of a purist when it comes to mixing cuisines across courses - I don't do it, 'cos I like my dinner parties to
> have a theme (and it makes things like deciding on drinks so much simpler!).

I am not quite as purist as that, but would hesitate about the precise
combination. I'd happily serve, say, tandoori chicken as an entree to a meal
that was otherwise "Western European".

--
All the Best
Ian Hoare
http://www.souvigne.com
mailbox full to avoid spam. try me at website

What wine to choose
 

"Ian Hoare" > wrote in message
...
> Salut/Hi Darkginger,

> >(and for me, it is splashing out) on a decent G, I'd rather save it to go
with lobster or scallops - both of which I feel are enhanced by/enhance it.
>
> sorry, Can't agree, as I find that both are rather dominated by the
powerful
> monolithic character of the grape. Have you had a good Alsace Riesing with
> these? They are often cheaper. Another possibility in a similar kind of
mold
> might be a Pinot Gris.

You could be right, cos I've noticed I eat veeeery slowly when I've got a
Gewurtz on the side - I like to savour each mouthful of the glorious stuff,
and then I like to take an age over each scallop/lobster morsel, too...
something more gluggable might serve better - I'll give your suggestions a
try (always grateful for wine advice from people who have spent more time
thinking about it than me!).

OK, you said that you can see yourself serving a tandoori starter followed
by something non-Indian - can you give a couple of examples? Sometimes I
feel quite restricted by my 'one cuisine at a time' theory, but I'm not sure
I have the courage to start combining! In fact the prospect is quite scary,
which is daft!

Also - I had a lovely scallop dish at an Italian resturant recently - they
were served in a light saffron sauce with deep fried ribbons of carrot to
accompany (now THAT was a revelation). I'm wondering if you, or anyone else,
has a recipe for something like a slightly currified saffron sauce, which
doesn't taste at all of 'curry powder' like the curry sauce you get in fish
'n chip shops does. Preferably not a masking sauce, just a light, clear
one - more of a saffron & spice jus.

Probably should have started at least 2 new threads for the above, but
bleah - it's Sunday, and I'm feeling lazy!

Jo


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Mixing cuisines [OT]
 

With apologies to those who feel this thread shouldn't be here at all.

Salut/Hi Darkginger,

le/on Sun, 11 Jul 2004 17:09:19 +0100, tu disais/you said:-

> I'll give your suggestions a try (always grateful for wine advice from people who have spent more time
>thinking about it than me!).

There are quite a few here with a _lot_ of experience at this, so you should
never hesitate to ask. We'll not necessarily agree, but at least the
discussion is usually done with good manners and good humour.

>OK, you said that you can see yourself serving a tandoori starter followed
>by something non-Indian - can you give a couple of examples?

Sure. Imagine a menu with

a light split pea soup
tandoori chicken with salad and pitas
moroccan shepherd's pie (minced lamb flavoured with cumin, coriander, ginger
apricot & lemon, the spuds crushed and flavoured with saffron, garlic and
olive oil) & salad
Oranges in caramel
Cheeses

or the last two vice versa.

That would work very well, but of course the eastern spices could be
considered cheating.

Another top of the head suggestion (we _always_ start a meal with soup here)

Tomato soup
coarse country terrine (french, or Gary Rhodes' rabbit terrine)
Raan, Bombay Brasserie's marinaded and roasted leg of lamb, posted by Elaine
J with french beans and rice
These are the ingredients (recipe on request)

1kg lamb leg; *
25 g peeled root ginger
25 g peeled cloves of garlic
3 tb mustard or vegetable oil
20 cashew nuts
900 ml natural yoghurt; or 2/3
1 tb kashmiri red chilli; -= or=-
1 tb cayenne pepper
1 tb tomato purée
2 ts garam masala
1 ts turmeric
2 tb brandy
1 tb single cream
sliced onions and lemon wedges to garnish

(Hard to match with wine, this one).

Moving away from Indian, I often serve something like the middle eastern
Imam bayeldi as an entree (french meaning) before something like a french
dish consisting of a roast leg of lamb served on top of potatoes boulangere

You have to have a fairly clear idea of the individual tastes of the dishes,
to work out a mind picture of whether the succession will work.

Another combination I often use (I'm half hungarian)
is a sumptuous hungarian mushroom and dill soup, followed by plain
charcuterie, and then perhaps a chicken paprikas, cheese and a light sorbet,
to give an exotic twist to the meal. You'd be surprised how well these
changes work.

Another delight is to use risotto as an entree. This will precede a main
course from almost anywhere in Europe, if the two are chosen to compliment
eachother.

>I have the courage to start combining! In fact the prospect is quite scary,
>which is daft!

Try it for yourself first and see how it works.

--
All the Best
Ian Hoare
http://www.souvigne.com
mailbox full to avoid spam. try me at website

Curry/saffron sauce
 

Salut/Hi TB,

le/on 12 Jul 2004 08:49:37 -0700, tu disais/you said:-

>> >has a recipe for something like a slightly currified saffron sauce, which
>> >doesn't taste at all of 'curry powder' like the curry sauce you get in fish
>> >'n chip shops does. Preferably not a masking sauce, just a light, clear
>> >one - more of a saffron & spice jus.
>>
>> Well, I have to say that most of the sauces I make of this type are pretty
>> rich, but you could probably adapt them.

>> Hey, an idea. Try the idea out on mussels, if you like them as they're FAR
>> cheaper than scallops.
>>
>> Open the mussels with herbs and white wine as for a marinière, but
>> incorporating a good pinch of saffron and/or 1/4 tsp or so of a decent curry
>> powder.


By an astonishingly serependitious coincidence, we went to lunch with a good
friend, a Belgian restaurateur, and one of the four pre-prandial nibbles he
gave us was - wait for it - mussels with a curry sauce!! And best of all, it
was served with an excellent (sorry folks forgot the grower) Pinot Gris from
Alsace. First of all, the match was good, not quite as good, IMO as it would
have been with a wine with a bit more "oomph" to it, perhaps a Grand Cru
Pinot Gris or perhaps an Auxerrois.

Thinking about you lot, I asked Jean-Claude what he'd done. Simplicity
itself. He opened the mussels in a large pan, into which he'd tipped 1/4
litre or so of "crème fraîche" (this is the typically french slightly sour
cream, that is thickened by the souring process), with a tsp of "curry
powder". This will have been a french curry powder, with quite a lot of
turmeric, and little ground chiles in it. Superb.

>> You would pour this sauce over the mussels in the middle of a moulded ring
>> of basmati rice. Serve with a really good white wine. Best would be a super
>> Meursault-Charmes with some bottle age.

>A question from a regular lurker/ occassional poster: what makes you
>suggest a Meursault. Does it match specially well with saffron? For
>instance, would one match it with other dishes with saffron? Or is it
>more a mix of the ingredients.

two and a half answers. One (half a reason) is that I have Meursault-Charmes
with some bottle age in my cellar. I know it's a frivolous reason, but
suggesting some obscure wine from the foothills of the Catskills, made only
in leap years is not much help to someone reading in the depths of Solihull.

More seriously. The slight hazelnuttiness and general roundness of Meursault
- which has much less of the characteristic "white peach" of the
neighbouring white burgundy villages - seems to me to make it a glorious
match with mussels, when these are served in a fairly rich sauce. I'm not
100% sure how the presence or absence of saffron or curry powder if used in
intelligent moderation would affect the quality of the match.

The last reason is that I've served this combination myself (as well as
others) to wine lovers on a number of occasions, and almost without
exception, they've said that it has illustrated to perfection what is meant
by a magnificent match between food and wine. OK, I know that the wine's no
slouch, and that one would be hard put to it not to like it, and that - for
those who can take their soft texture - a classic mouclade is a pretty
magnificent dish. But we've all agreed that the marriage goes far beyond
that.

As for the match between scallops done with a saffron/curry sauce, and a
wine, I think there anough similarities of flavour for the match to be as
good. I know I sometimes write as if I was postulating _the_ perfect match,
specifying Mr Stepandcatchit's Outer Mongolian shiraz/malbec blend with a
lamb stew made with 8 month old free range french lamb and organic sun dried
apricots. But in truth, there are a sheaf of matches between food and wines,
and that a 5/5 can occur with several of each.

Predicting food and wine matches is a bit like calculating the weather,
where they calculate 1000s of times with very slight variations of input
data, and then end up with a sheaf of results. If they all agree, they have
a confident prediction. So food and wine matching is as much a matter of
chaos theory and serendipity as anything, but just as in weather
forecasting, you sometimes have a feeling about a match, and just as in
weather forecasting, experience can often lead to wonderful results.

BTW, I was glad to have encouraged you to delurk.

--
All the Best
Ian Hoare
http://www.souvigne.com
mailbox full to avoid spam. try me at website

Curry/saffron sauce
 

Salut/Hi TB,

le/on 12 Jul 2004 08:49:37 -0700, tu disais/you said:-

>> >has a recipe for something like a slightly currified saffron sauce, which
>> >doesn't taste at all of 'curry powder' like the curry sauce you get in fish
>> >'n chip shops does. Preferably not a masking sauce, just a light, clear
>> >one - more of a saffron & spice jus.
>>
>> Well, I have to say that most of the sauces I make of this type are pretty
>> rich, but you could probably adapt them.

>> Hey, an idea. Try the idea out on mussels, if you like them as they're FAR
>> cheaper than scallops.
>>
>> Open the mussels with herbs and white wine as for a marinière, but
>> incorporating a good pinch of saffron and/or 1/4 tsp or so of a decent curry
>> powder.


By an astonishingly serependitious coincidence, we went to lunch with a good
friend, a Belgian restaurateur, and one of the four pre-prandial nibbles he
gave us was - wait for it - mussels with a curry sauce!! And best of all, it
was served with an excellent (sorry folks forgot the grower) Pinot Gris from
Alsace. First of all, the match was good, not quite as good, IMO as it would
have been with a wine with a bit more "oomph" to it, perhaps a Grand Cru
Pinot Gris or perhaps an Auxerrois.

Thinking about you lot, I asked Jean-Claude what he'd done. Simplicity
itself. He opened the mussels in a large pan, into which he'd tipped 1/4
litre or so of "crème fraîche" (this is the typically french slightly sour
cream, that is thickened by the souring process), with a tsp of "curry
powder". This will have been a french curry powder, with quite a lot of
turmeric, and little ground chiles in it. Superb.

>> You would pour this sauce over the mussels in the middle of a moulded ring
>> of basmati rice. Serve with a really good white wine. Best would be a super
>> Meursault-Charmes with some bottle age.

>A question from a regular lurker/ occassional poster: what makes you
>suggest a Meursault. Does it match specially well with saffron? For
>instance, would one match it with other dishes with saffron? Or is it
>more a mix of the ingredients.

two and a half answers. One (half a reason) is that I have Meursault-Charmes
with some bottle age in my cellar. I know it's a frivolous reason, but
suggesting some obscure wine from the foothills of the Catskills, made only
in leap years is not much help to someone reading in the depths of Solihull.

More seriously. The slight hazelnuttiness and general roundness of Meursault
- which has much less of the characteristic "white peach" of the
neighbouring white burgundy villages - seems to me to make it a glorious
match with mussels, when these are served in a fairly rich sauce. I'm not
100% sure how the presence or absence of saffron or curry powder if used in
intelligent moderation would affect the quality of the match.

The last reason is that I've served this combination myself (as well as
others) to wine lovers on a number of occasions, and almost without
exception, they've said that it has illustrated to perfection what is meant
by a magnificent match between food and wine. OK, I know that the wine's no
slouch, and that one would be hard put to it not to like it, and that - for
those who can take their soft texture - a classic mouclade is a pretty
magnificent dish. But we've all agreed that the marriage goes far beyond
that.

As for the match between scallops done with a saffron/curry sauce, and a
wine, I think there anough similarities of flavour for the match to be as
good. I know I sometimes write as if I was postulating _the_ perfect match,
specifying Mr Stepandcatchit's Outer Mongolian shiraz/malbec blend with a
lamb stew made with 8 month old free range french lamb and organic sun dried
apricots. But in truth, there are a sheaf of matches between food and wines,
and that a 5/5 can occur with several of each.

Predicting food and wine matches is a bit like calculating the weather,
where they calculate 1000s of times with very slight variations of input
data, and then end up with a sheaf of results. If they all agree, they have
a confident prediction. So food and wine matching is as much a matter of
chaos theory and serendipity as anything, but just as in weather
forecasting, you sometimes have a feeling about a match, and just as in
weather forecasting, experience can often lead to wonderful results.

BTW, I was glad to have encouraged you to delurk.

--
All the Best
Ian Hoare
http://www.souvigne.com
mailbox full to avoid spam. try me at website

What wine to choose
 

Best wine with curry a glass of fresh cow ****.

Curry/saffron sauce
 

"Ian Hoare" > wrote in message
...
> Salut/Hi TB,

(snip of a lot of interesting food & wine commentary)

> BTW, I was glad to have encouraged you to delurk.

I'll second that. I got some good ideas to try with scallops. They're not
particularly expensive here. :^)

Tom S