I'm not a fan of the system.
However, if I'm somewhere (like US) where that is the system, I act accordingly.
What I find truly objectionable is those that decry the system,
and then use it as an excuse to screw the waitstaff.

"DaleW" > wrote in message
...
> I'm not a fan of the system.
> However, if I'm somewhere (like US) where that is the system, I act
> accordingly.
> What I find truly objectionable is those that decry the system,
> and then use it as an excuse to screw the waitstaff.

I don't really believe any diners set out to screw waitstaff.
The waitstaff are screwed by a past-its-use-by-date system where
profit-hungry proprietors choose not to pay employees a decent wage.
What other industry expects the goodwill of clients to pay or top up staff
salaries?

Cheers!

Martin

On Apr 15, 12:50*am, "Martin Field" > wrote:
> "DaleW" > wrote in message
>
> ...
>
> > I'm not a fan of the system.
> > However, if I'm somewhere (like US) where that is the system, I act
> > accordingly.
> > What I find truly objectionable is those that decry the system,
> > and then use it as an excuse to screw the waitstaff.
>
> I don't really believe any diners set out to screw waitstaff.
> The waitstaff are screwed by a past-its-use-by-date system where
> profit-hungry proprietors choose not to pay employees a decent wage.
> What other industry expects the goodwill of clients to pay or top up staff
> salaries?
>
> Cheers!
>
> Martin

I hate to use the "it is what it is" defense" but the system isn't
going to change in the US. Most place that I've travelled to in
Europe have a tipping system also in one form or another. If you
don't tip because you don't like the system...you're screwing the wait
staff.

"Bi!!" > wrote in
:
>
> I hate to use the "it is what it is" defense" but the system isn't
> going to change in the US. Most place that I've travelled to in
> Europe have a tipping system also in one form or another. If you
> don't tip because you don't like the system...you're screwing the wait
> staff.

Not in Spain, France, Portugal, Andorra, Italy or Germany.

In any of these places you can tip if you want to thank for the food or
service. And I usually do.

s

On Apr 16, 3:34*am, Mike Tommasi > wrote:
> On 15/04/2011 23:10, santiago wrote:
>
> > > *wrote in
> :
>
> >> I hate to use the "it is what it is" defense" but the system isn't
> >> going to change in the US. *Most place that I've travelled to in
> >> Europe have a tipping system also in one form or another. *If you
> >> don't tip because you don't like the system...you're screwing the wait
> >> staff.
>
> > Not in Spain, France, Portugal, Andorra, Italy or Germany.
>
> > In any of these places you can tip if you want to thank for the food or
> > service. And I usually do.
>
> Same here.
>
> But it gets more complicated. In the US, while the system lends itself
> to abuse, a waiter has the potential of earning sums that no European
> waiter could dream of. I know of a place in SoCal where the waiters make
> over 100k. Well over. This may be the exception, but there are waiters
> in the US that would never want to work any other way.

That $100,000 waiter would be the vast exception. I have been to a
number of restaurants in Europe where a "service" charge was added to
the bill so I'm not sure what the difference is.

On 4/16/2011 10:04 AM, Bi!! wrote:
> On Apr 16, 3:34 am, Mike > wrote:
>> On 15/04/2011 23:10, santiago wrote:
>>
>>> > wrote in
>>> :
>>
>>>> I hate to use the "it is what it is" defense" but the system isn't
>>>> going to change in the US. Most place that I've travelled to in
>>>> Europe have a tipping system also in one form or another. If you
>>>> don't tip because you don't like the system...you're screwing the wait
>>>> staff.
>>
>>> Not in Spain, France, Portugal, Andorra, Italy or Germany.
>>
>>> In any of these places you can tip if you want to thank for the food or
>>> service. And I usually do.
>>
>> Same here.
>>
>> But it gets more complicated. In the US, while the system lends itself
>> to abuse, a waiter has the potential of earning sums that no European
>> waiter could dream of. I know of a place in SoCal where the waiters make
>> over 100k. Well over. This may be the exception, but there are waiters
>> in the US that would never want to work any other way.
>
> That $100,000 waiter would be the vast exception. I have been to a
> number of restaurants in Europe where a "service" charge was added to
> the bill so I'm not sure what the difference is.

Funny, perhaps we don't go the same places but all the restaurants with
waiters I have gone to in Europe have added a Service charge to the
bill. Rounding up for good service to the next 5 or 10 is still possible.

--


James Silverton, Potomac

I'm "not"

James Silverton > wrote in
:

> Funny, perhaps we don't go the same places but all the restaurants
> with waiters I have gone to in Europe have added a Service charge to
> the bill. Rounding up for good service to the next 5 or 10 is still
> possible.

Frankly, I am surprised. Was that recently?

s.

The thing that bothers me is when a restaurant adds
an automatic gratuity to the bill. Good service,
bad service, doesn't make any difference on the tab.

Dick in the USA

On Sat, 16 Apr 2011 17:09:51 +0000 (UTC), santiago >
wrote:

>James Silverton > wrote in
:
>
>> Funny, perhaps we don't go the same places but all the restaurants
>> with waiters I have gone to in Europe have added a Service charge to
>> the bill. Rounding up for good service to the next 5 or 10 is still
>> possible.
>
>Frankly, I am surprised. Was that recently?
>
>s.
He is probably refering to the statement on the menu "service compris"
or similar service included.
Joseph Coulter
J&B Journeys
www.josephcoulter.com

904 685 5317

On 16/04/2011 18:09, santiago wrote:
> James > wrote in
> :
>
>> Funny, perhaps we don't go the same places but all the restaurants
>> with waiters I have gone to in Europe have added a Service charge to
>> the bill. Rounding up for good service to the next 5 or 10 is still
>> possible.
>
> Frankly, I am surprised. Was that recently?

Not at all uncommon in the UK. Here, if there is no service charge I
usually add atound 10%, depending on how I feel about the experience in
the restaurant. But if you don't tip it is not like you are screwing
the waiters, and no one chases after you.

In principle I would rather do away with the system.

--
www.winenous.co.uk

On 15/04/2011 14:31, Bi!! wrote:

> I hate to use the "it is what it is" defense" but the system isn't
> going to change in the US.

Most things like that change eventually. The question is when, and what to.

Here is one alternative pricing model that is happening in Chicago now:
http://www.businessweek.com/magazine...3098867567.htm

--
www.winenous.co.uk

On Sat, 16 Apr 2011 14:47:59 -0500, Dickr wrote:

> The thing that bothers me is when a restaurant adds an automatic
> gratuity to the bill. Good service, bad service, doesn't make any
> difference on the tab.
>
> Dick in the USA

Many years ago, on a bus tour in Mexico we were taken to a real "tourist
trap" restaurant after seeing the pyramids. I can read and speak Spanish
so I knew that the "propina" was already added to the bill. However, the
other members of our group did not know this so they were leaving tips as
though they were in the US.

Godzilla