It strikes me that wine is much more expensive in the UK and the US
than in The Netherlands. Yes, we do have VAT (18,5%). But nevertheless
the price of the same bottle in the US and UK can be more than 50%
higher than here in the NL. Of course, shipping to the US costs. But
shipping to the UK should cost more or less the same as to the NL.

Lemme give two examples. A bottle of Primi Rioja costs less than 5
euro in the NL, and almost 8 pounds (12 euro) in the UK. A bottle of
Barros LBV port costs 10 euro in the NL and more than double or even
triple in the US.

Is this some kind of protectionism by the US, stimulating the sales of
'local' wines (Californian etc.)? Are wines sold for a lower price to
Dutch wine merchants than to UK and US wine merchants?

Hannes Minkema
Amsterdam, The Netherlands

Mi e' parso che abbia scritto:

> It strikes me that wine is much more expensive in the UK
> and the US than in The Netherlands. Yes, we do have VAT
> (18,5%). But nevertheless the price of the same bottle in
> the US and UK can be more than 50% higher than here in
> the NL. Of course, shipping to the US costs. But shipping
> to the UK should cost more or less the same as to the NL.

Maybe wine is consumed more in the Netherlands than in UK/USA and
so those markets see wine as a "specialty" food, with consequent
high pricing.
It also maybe that the wine commercial system, in the
Netherlands, is less greedy than the UK and US ones? This may be
due to more free competition, which is minimal in markets ruled
by few big operators as in UK and USA.
Sure, the sea transport makes costs rise when a spayard exports
in UK or USA instead of The Netherlands, but a difference of more
than twice the price is too much to come only from shipping
costs.

BTW, I have been in the Netherlands many times before, and always
found you have a very wide choice of wines also in small
supermarkets, and this is wonderful. I never missed a tour to the
nearest Albert Hein
--
Vilco
Think Pink , Drink Rose'

Hannes,

> It strikes me that wine is much more expensive in the UK and the US
> than in The Netherlands. Yes, we do have VAT (18,5%). But nevertheless
> the price of the same bottle in the US and UK can be more than 50%
> higher than here in the NL. Of course, shipping to the US costs. But
> shipping to the UK should cost more or less the same as to the NL.
>
> Lemme give two examples. A bottle of Primi Rioja costs less than 5
> euro in the NL, and almost 8 pounds (12 euro) in the UK. A bottle of
> Barros LBV port costs 10 euro in the NL and more than double or even
> triple in the US.
>
> Is this some kind of protectionism by the US, stimulating the sales of
> 'local' wines (Californian etc.)? Are wines sold for a lower price to
> Dutch wine merchants than to UK and US wine merchants?

OK, you're right!
But can you tell me why a Weber BabyQ bbq is $126 in the US and 199 Euro in
the Netherlands? Is this due to the shipping?
So if it is true for one item it is wrong for another.

Just be happy that wine is so cheap here.....:-)

Regards,

Robèrt

wrote:


> Is this some kind of protectionism by the US, stimulating the sales of
> 'local' wines (Californian etc.)? Are wines sold for a lower price to
> Dutch wine merchants than to UK and US wine merchants?

It *is* a form of protectionism, but not the sort that the WTO can
attack. In the US, a wine passes through 3 different sets of hands (at
least) going from winemaker to consumer: importer, distributor,
retailer. This so-called "3-tier" system greatly inflates the price
since there is little to no pressure on the distributor to reduce his
profit margin (because more and more there is a single major distributor
in each state that has a virtual, legal monopoly), so greed at that
level is rampant.

However, note that a wine from California sold in the other 49 states
still must usually pass through 2 of those 3 tiers, including the
dreaded distributor's, so their prices are also high (this is compounded
by the atypical situation that wines sold by the winery are priced at
full retail price (i.e., much higher than the price they charge the
distributor).

HTH
Mark Lipton

What you say is true, Mark, but I think the weak dollar vs. strong Euro
also makes the situation worse here in the US.

Dan-O

Salut/Hi Dan The Man,

le/on 15 Jun 2005 09:25:40 -0700, tu disais/you said:-

>What you say is true, Mark, but I think the weak dollar vs. strong Euro
>also makes the situation worse here in the US.

Bordeaux 2000 sold en primeur when the dollar was stronger? A wine offered
en primeur at a (relatively) high prive in Francs here in France, was
offered at almost that price in dollars in the US to collectors. Don't tell
me that a hike of 7 times is due to anything other than greed on the part of
monopolies.

--
All the Best
Ian Hoare
http://www.souvigne.com
mailbox full to avoid spam. try me at website

Ian Hoare wrote:
> Salut/Hi Dan The Man,
>
> le/on 15 Jun 2005 09:25:40 -0700, tu disais/you said:-
>
> >What you say is true, Mark, but I think the weak dollar vs. strong Euro
> >also makes the situation worse here in the US.
>
> Bordeaux 2000 sold en primeur when the dollar was stronger? A wine offered
> en primeur at a (relatively) high prive in Francs here in France, was
> offered at almost that price in dollars in the US to collectors. Don't tell
> me that a hike of 7 times is due to anything other than greed on the part of
> monopolies.
>
> --
> All the Best
> Ian Hoare
> http://www.souvigne.com
> mailbox full to avoid spam. try me at website

Yes Ian, greed is a HUGE part of it. And I don't see the situation
changing anytime soon - the distributors and wholesalers have powerful
voices in Washington, to the detriment of consumers. Also, the
anti-France boycott has just about run its course, which will cause an
increase in demand.

Dan-O

There is £1.26 excise duty per bottle in the UK plus VAT on top of that
which might explain some of the difference.

> wrote in message
...
>
> It strikes me that wine is much more expensive in the UK and the US
> than in The Netherlands. Yes, we do have VAT (18,5%). But nevertheless
> the price of the same bottle in the US and UK can be more than 50%
> higher than here in the NL. Of course, shipping to the US costs. But
> shipping to the UK should cost more or less the same as to the NL.
>
> Lemme give two examples. A bottle of Primi Rioja costs less than 5
> euro in the NL, and almost 8 pounds (12 euro) in the UK. A bottle of
> Barros LBV port costs 10 euro in the NL and more than double or even
> triple in the US.
>
> Is this some kind of protectionism by the US, stimulating the sales of
> 'local' wines (Californian etc.)? Are wines sold for a lower price to
> Dutch wine merchants than to UK and US wine merchants?
>
> Hannes Minkema
> Amsterdam, The Netherlands
>

Salut/Hi Keith,

le/on Wed, 15 Jun 2005 20:57:01 GMT, tu disais/you said:-

>There is £1.26 excise duty per bottle in the UK plus VAT on top of that
>which might explain some of the difference.

There is excise duty in France (forget the level) as well as VAT (at the
higher level of 19.6%)

--
All the Best
Ian Hoare
http://www.souvigne.com
mailbox full to avoid spam. try me at website