Yesterday I cracked open the bottle of Kirkland brand 2000 St. Emilion
Grand Cru purchased at Costco two weeks ago. I shared it with three
friends, one of whom is a well-known wine writer, the other two
knowledgeable wine aficionados. To make a fair comparison, we opened
three additional wines we figured were of comparable style and age:

2000 Ste. Michelle Cold Creek Merlot (1/2 bottle)
2000 Ch. Faugeres St. Emilion Grand Cru
2000 Ridge bordeaux blend Montebello (64% cab, 28% merlot, 8% petit
verdot) (We assumed this was declassified Montebello)

The Ste. Michelle was listed at 12.9% alcohol, all the others were
listed at 13%. (Yep, we were astounded, too, that the Ridge wasn't
15%. It's tough to find California cabs these days that aren't
near-port wines.)

Hands down, the Ridge blend was the winner. I'm used to enjoying their
stunning zinfandels, but obviously they also know what they're doing
with cab/merlot blends that closely approximate cab/merlot-based
Bordeaux. And they can do it at the same alcohol level as Bordeaux
wines. How thoroughly refreshing.

The Ste. Michelle was good opener, and the Faugeres was decent but a
bit austere. It may be on the verge of closing down for a few years.

The Costco? Ewwww, baby! Spit it sooner than later. For starters, it
was contaminated with brettanomyces. You couldn't miss it. Bois de
Barnwood, Haute du Terres Saddlebags, like a robust day at the
stables. Mis en bouteille avec cht eau. That's two words, and those
of you who know French will know what I mean.

For all practical purposes, I considered it just this side of a
perfect candidate for cleaning auto parts. My wine writer pal
recoiled from it as well, though he managed to find some redeeming
qualities once the brett had aired itself out a bit. On its own the
wine is nothing special, and almost undrinkable. When paired with a
bit of steak it was tolerable. But it had all the personality of a
tubeless tire, no mid-palate and no finish, flat as two-day-old cheap
champagne. (Er, not that I'd know what cheap champagne is, of course.)

My final answer: A wine that was rode hard and put away wet. I would
never buy it again, except maybe to poison my enemies. My writer pal's
assessment: A not untypical inexpensive Bordeaux that's okay to drink
with the proper food. He called it an acceptable $6.00 bottle of wine.
Unfortunately, Costco is getting $16 for this plonk. Our two
companions also voted thumbs down on it, and two thumbs way up for the
Ridge.

Btw, we were unable to determine the source of the wine, other than a
St. Emilion co-op. There was nothing on the label or the cork to
indicate the actual producer. Under the circumstances, I'm not
surprised the guy wants to remain anonymous.

JJ

In message >
wrote:

> Yesterday I cracked open the bottle of Kirkland brand 2000 St. Emilion
> Grand Cru purchased at Costco two weeks ago.
SNIP
> The Costco? Ewwww, baby! Spit it sooner than later. For starters, it
> was contaminated with brettanomyces. You couldn't miss it. Bois de
> Barnwood, Haute du Terres Saddlebags, like a robust day at the
> stables. Mis en bouteille avec cht eau. That's two words, and those
> of you who know French will know what I mean.
et cetera
>
> Btw, we were unable to determine the source of the wine, other than a
> St. Emilion co-op. There was nothing on the label or the cork to
> indicate the actual producer. Under the circumstances, I'm not
> surprised the guy wants to remain anonymous.
>
> JJ
Oh dear - that is rather what I feared. If it truly was St. Emilion
Grand Cru I would firmly have expected some sign of its producer and
origin. I am not sure what you mean by, and what makes you say:
> we were unable to determine the source of the wine, other than a
> St. Emilion co-op
There are no co-ops except the Union des Producteurs. I am sure that
there would have been a clear indication that it was a UDP wine. More
fundamentally all St. Emilion Grand Crus have to be bottled at the
place where they were made. Did it not have any sign on the cork of
that or of a grower's name? If it was exported in bulk from somewhere
and bottled under a local blend name it is NOT, and could never be,
St. Emilion Grand Cru. Of the many hundreds, if not thousands, of
bottles of St. Emilion Grand Cru that I have seen, opened and drunk,I
have never seen a bottle which has no indication of its provenance on
the label, let alone the cork. If I were you I would go back to the
vendor and demand to see some proof of what you bought being what it
claims to be. In England I would refer it to the local Trading
Standards officer but I do not know if you have an equivalent. The
importer should hold documents issued by the grower or exporting
negociant clearly proving the origin of wine. All in all I suspect
some inferior wine has been passed off. Nobody who has bothered to
submit his wine to two separate tastings for approval as Appellation
Grand Cru and has had it approved, is going to keep his association
with the wine hidden.
Generally speaking may I suggest that anybody who sees wine from
France without a clear indication, not only that it comes from some
famous Appellation, but also of who made it, should be very suspicious
and demand that its seller gives further and better particulars?


Timothy Hartley

On Mon, 27 Jun 2005 10:30:16 +0100, Timothy Hartley
> wrote:

>There are no co-ops except the Union des Producteurs. I am sure that
>there would have been a clear indication that it was a UDP wine.

It said it was a UDP wine on the label, but that's all it said. I
thought there were other co-ops in St. Emilion, but now that I think
about it, why would there be?

>More fundamentally all St. Emilion Grand Crus have to be bottled at the
>place where they were made. Did it not have any sign on the cork of
>that or of a grower's name?

Unfortunately, I tossed the cork along with the wine. But I do recall
looking for anything resembling a distinct producer's name on the
cork, and there was none.

> If I were you I would go back to the
>vendor and demand to see some proof of what you bought being what it
>claims to be.

Wait til you read the e-mail flying back and forth between me and
Costco. See below.

> All in all I suspect some inferior wine has been passed off.

That was my suspicion, too. The Costco rep says otherwise. In fact,
she trots out some heavy hitters in support of the wine. Check this
out:

>Thank you for taking the time to write about the KS St Emilion.
>
>Not understanding your wine tasting credentials, I am
>perplexed on your assessment of this wine. I recently tasted
>again and found the fruit, acid, tannin and alcohol are well
>balanced while showing depth and complexity on a long finish
>(no sign of brett). This wine just won "Critics Gold Award" in one
>of the most prestigious blind competitions in the world.
>You may be familiar with some of the judges: Chief Judge
>Mary Ewing- Mulligan, MW; Michael Apstein; Gerald Boyd;
>Stephen Brook; Micheal Franz; Richard Carleton Hacker;
>Paul Lukacs; Ed McCarthy; Elin McCoy; Nick Passmore;
>Leslie Sbrocco and Marguerite Thomas. This list is made
>up highly regarded professional wine journalists.
>
>We value you as a member and encourage you to try other
>Kirkland Signature wines that have been carefully crafted from
>all over the world.
>
>Please feel free to contact me should you have further
>questions or comments.
>
>Many thanks and kind regards,
>Heather McEachran
>Costco Beer, Wine & Spirits

Okay, here's one question: What the f*** were THOSE guys
drinking?!?!?!?

Not to mention:

What "Critic's Gold Award?"
What "prestigious blind competition?"

I'm telling you, this wine was worse than lame. Smelled like parts of
a donkey, too. My wine writer friend was a little kinder to it than I
was, but he's the one who first spotted the brett taint. The best he
could come up with at the end of the evening was, "It's showing a lot
of mushroom." The two others in our party included a woman who knows
good wines and what they should taste like, and the wife of the wine
writer, who probably samples dozens of wines a month. Both of them
twisted up their faces at the Kirkland stuff, while lauding in various
degrees our other three choices of the evening.

So, I don't care what the Costco gal says, this wine was barely
drinkable. St. Emilion is one of my most favorite wine areas of
France, and I know what a good Grand Cru from there is supposed to
taste like. This wasn't even close.

JJ

I still find it difficult to believe that this was a UDP wine and that
there was no other indication of what it was. It is fair to say that
the bottom end of every Apellation attracts different views but this
is labelled Grand Cru and therefore ought to be better than a St.
Emilion AOC. they make four Grand Crus: Aurelius, Cotes Rocheuses,
Galius, Pagus Novertas. You can check out their labels at
www.udpse.com and as you will see they all bear the name of the Union
in full and very prominently.

By the way when you fist posted you indicated that there was no mark
at all to indicate any claim to provenance and later you said it came
from a St. Emilion co-op, without being more specific, are you sure
that this was a UDP wine? What did the Costco rep say about where it
had come from? If he or she had nothing to hide they would surely give
you that information

I am very intrigued by this mystery!

Timothy Hartley

Not much mystery.

The back includes a label says, "Mis en bouteille a la propriete par
L'Union des Producteurs de Saint Emilion a 33330 Saint-Emilion,
France" Imported by Winery Exchange, Novato, Cal.

The front of the label has a typical Kirkalnd Signature label, with no
indication where the wine is from except that it's labelled St.
Emilion Grand Cru. No further info on the cork, either.

As for the snooty, condescending Costco rep... Hoo-boy. She wrote and
said she was "perplexed" by my assessment of the wine. (Ignoring the
fact three other veterans tasters had also found it disturbingly
sub-standard.) She tried to impress me with a list of "celebrity"
judges, claiming they'd awarded this wine a "Critic's Gold" at some
"prestigious" but indeterminate mass tasting. She also let slip that
300 of the 1300 wines tasted were awarded gold. Damn near 25% got
gold??? I wouldn't exactly be touting my wine or my judging
credentials after a group brown-nosing like that.

Part of my response to her:

++ I don't know all of the judges you list for your wine tasting, but
my wine writer friend knows most of them. He describes the group as
having a "wide range of palates, some good, some bad, some pretty
dismal." That sounds like a fair assessment of most judging panels.
I've never been particularly impressed with "celebrity" judging
panels, mostly because what they're tasting and judging is often not
the finished product and/or is not tasted under the same conditions as
the average consumer. I'd have been a lot more impressed if those
folks had gotten their KS 2000 St. Emilion out of the same bin I did
at the 4th Avenue So. Costco in Seattle three weeks ago.

++ What exactly is a "Critic's Gold Award?" There are so many tasting
these days, and so many "Gold" awards, that it's almost impossible to
tell them apart without a scorecard. Further, and as my wine writer
friend also notes, any "blind" judging usually brings odd bottles to
the top, as few tasters can ever agree on much of anything.

++ The bottom line for me has nothing to do with anybody's wine
tastings but my own. St. Emilion is one of my most favorite wine
regions of France. Over the years I've enjoyed many wines of the
appellation, from low to high end. The reality is this wine was barely
tolerable, and that was only by pairing it with an expensive cut of
prime rib. It was brett contaminated, had no character other than the
funky barnyard smell and taste, and in my opinion was an extremely
poor example of a St. Emilion Grand Cru. My writer friend was a bit
more kind to it, but not by much. I stand by my earlier review, and
those who sampled the wine with me do, too.

++ You have many wines on the Costco floor that are very drinkable for
half the price of this wine. Price point being a generally accepted
indicator of quality, a $16 bottle of 2000 St. Emilion should be
substantially better than a 2003 bottle of Beringer Founders Estate
cabernet, which Costco sells for $7.99. In this case, having tasted
both, I'll take the Beringer. It's not going to rock my world, but
it's not going to bray at me, either.

++ Nobody's prefect, and Costco has brought many excellent wines to
its members over the years. I've consumed a lot of them, and some of
them are still on hold in the cellar. But once in a while everybody
gets hosed. I got hosed on this one, and I think Costco did, too. ++

She failed to see the humor. Her response:

>Yes, it's true - every judge and consumer will have a
>different perception on any given wine. It is such a
>subjective product. Thank you for your opinion.

"It's such a subjective product. Thank you for sharing," tsk tsk. All
she forgot to add , but the implication was clear, was "Now, F off."
Hey, if she wants to drink plonk and call it gold plonk, that's her
business. But I feel obligated to friends of mine who buy wine at
Costco to call it Ch. Donkey Stall if that's what it tastes like.

YMMV,

JJ

wrote in news:rdd8c1tc9h3e4t27os4g4hs4i2qv7up7ol@
4ax.com:



> "It's such a subjective product. Thank you for sharing," tsk tsk. All
> she forgot to add , but the implication was clear, was "Now, F off."
> Hey, if she wants to drink plonk and call it gold plonk, that's her
> business. But I feel obligated to friends of mine who buy wine at
> Costco to call it Ch. Donkey Stall if that's what it tastes like.
>
> YMMV,
>
> JJ

So I guess it is a good thing that my Costco doesn't carry this, as I would
have to buy a bottle for "objectivity" and then hate it!

--
Joseph Coulter
Cruises and Vacations
http://www.josephcoulter.com/

On Thu, 30 Jun 2005 15:05:01 -0500, jcoulter
> wrote:

>So I guess it is a good thing that my Costco doesn't carry this, as I would
>have to buy a bottle for "objectivity" and then hate it!

LOL!

I've gotten a lot of good wine at Costco over the years, and at decent
prices. For instance, it's hard to beat a 2000 Tignanello for $59. I
had great expectations, and almost equal trepidation, about a 2K St.
Emilion with a Kirkland label on it . I was hoping to be pleasantly
surprised, but the dice and came up snake eyes.

JJ

> wrote in message
...
> On Thu, 30 Jun 2005 15:05:01 -0500, jcoulter
> > wrote:
>
>>So I guess it is a good thing that my Costco doesn't carry this, as I
>>would
>>have to buy a bottle for "objectivity" and then hate it!
>
> LOL!
>
> I've gotten a lot of good wine at Costco over the years, and at decent
> prices. For instance, it's hard to beat a 2000 Tignanello for $59. I
> had great expectations, and almost equal trepidation, about a 2K St.
> Emilion with a Kirkland label on it . I was hoping to be pleasantly
> surprised, but the dice and came up snake eyes.
>
> JJ
>

When my wife recently announced that she was doing a Costco run, I asked her
to pick up a bottle of the St. Emilion..... When she couldn't find it, she
brought home a Kirkland 2001 Alexander Valley Cab. Lots of tannin with
American oak. Not much in the way of fruit. The cork went back in and we
left it sit for day and the tannins seemed to calm down, but still pretty
flat in the fruit department. Definitely not a good QPR at 19.00 USD.

I've had better reds from the Alexander Valley Vineyard --Costco at about
$15.00. Are we seeing a trend here?

M

On Fri, 01 Jul 2005 12:00:26 GMT, "Mike P"
> wrote:

>When my wife recently announced that she was doing a Costco run, I asked her
>to pick up a bottle of the St. Emilion..... When she couldn't find it, she
>brought home a Kirkland 2001 Alexander Valley Cab. Lots of tannin with
>American oak. Not much in the way of fruit. The cork went back in and we
>left it sit for day and the tannins seemed to calm down, but still pretty
>flat in the fruit department. Definitely not a good QPR at 19.00 USD.
>
>I've had better reds from the Alexander Valley Vineyard --Costco at about
>$15.00. Are we seeing a trend here?

I'm a big fan of Alexander Valley cabs. I started with the lower end,
like the 1993 Chateau Souverain and 1994 Estancia years ago, then
gravitated towards Hanna. So, if Costco is going to sell me an Alex
cab for $15, it better be at least as good as the earlier $10
Souverain/Estancia versions (allowing for "inflation" of the last
decade). From your description, doesn't sound like it.

But I'll bet if you sent your comments to the gal at Costco, she'd
respond with something like, "Not understanding your wine tasting
credentials, I am perplexed on your assessment of this wine. I
recently tasted again and found the fruit, acid, tannin and alcohol
are well balanced while showing depth and complexity on a long finish.
This wine just won "Critics Gold Award" in one of the most prestigious
blind competitions in the world." Then she'd list all the judges and
thank you for sharing.

Heh...

JJ