Hi folks,

I'm new to wine making. I have a (red) grapevine, which has produced a
good crop this year in the Midlands. So thought I would make some
wine. Got the books from the library, followed the directions, I felt
pretty well.

The must fermented well in the plastic bucket (SG started at 1.085,
after added sugar), after 7 days I put it through a mesh and
transferred to a demijohn (SG = 1.026) and put on an airlock. Kept it
in the airing cupboard, which seemed nicely warm. But fermentation
stopped. SG at 1.025. After 4 days, I tried to restart fermentation by
preparing more yeast and adding it to it. But failed.

I'm not sure where to go from here?
(From the books, I'm supposed to ferment until the SG is < water.)

Thanks for any help you can give. Sorry if this is a very novice
question!

Regards
Mike

Mike wrote:

> The must fermented well in the plastic bucket (SG started at 1.085,
> after added sugar), after 7 days I put it through a mesh and
> transferred to a demijohn (SG = 1.026) and put on an airlock. Kept it
> in the airing cupboard, which seemed nicely warm. But fermentation
> stopped. SG at 1.025. After 4 days, I tried to restart fermentation by
> preparing more yeast and adding it to it. But failed.

It probably would have been best to rack if off the grapes when the SG
was near or below 1.000

What I would do know is prepare another starter, and then draw off a
litre or two of wine and add this to the starter. Once that is going
nicely, add another few litres of wine and make sure it is going nicely.
Then you can add that back to the whole lot. Make sure you don't let the
wine get too cold either, that's another cause for a stuck ferment! HTH

--
charles

"Once ... in the wilds of Afghanistan, I lost my corkscrew, and we were
forced to live on nothing but food and water for days."
- W.C. Fields

"Mike" > wrote:

> The must fermented well in the plastic bucket (SG started at 1.085,
> after added sugar), after 7 days I put it through a mesh and
> transferred to a demijohn (SG = 1.026) and put on an airlock. Kept it
> in the airing cupboard, which seemed nicely warm. But fermentation
> stopped. SG at 1.025. After 4 days, I tried to restart fermentation by
> preparing more yeast and adding it to it. But failed.

When you put "it through a mesh", you most likely lost the majority of the
yeast colony, and they couldn't regenerate in a non-aerobic high-alcohol
environment. Similarly, you were unable to restart by simply adding yeast,
in this environment. Or perhaps all the yeast nutrients were used up.

> I'm not sure where to go from here?

See "Stuck fermentation" on http://winemaking.jackkeller.net/problems.asp.

> (From the books, I'm supposed to ferment until the SG is < water.)

You should have fermented "on the skins" until the SG was around 1.000, and
then racked to a secondary container, allowing the wine to "ferment out".
The final SG may be as low as 0.990-0.995.

Another way to help a stuck fermentation is to stir daily. By getting
rid of the CO2 and adding the little air that the yeasts require, you
keep them at their happiest. Do this for a couple of days after you
add the new yeast culture. I found this when fermenting pure
sugars--the activity really picked up about an hour after I stirred
out the CO2.

The airing cupboard may be the culprit. Many winemakers tend to keep
our carboys in corners (on a cement block to save the back) and not in
cupboards. Or else the laundry room sink/table gets refitted to be the
winemaking station. The lack of freely circulating air probably kept
the CO2 too high and killed the yeasts. (it's sort of like dying if
your kidneys fail and no dialysis...)

After the primary fermentation, it is OK to hold the carboy at 15-18 C
and it is more important to have constant temperature. Any open area
that is free of dust or mould will do very well.--Irene

(Mike) wrote in message . com>...
> Hi folks,
>
> I'm new to wine making. I have a (red) grapevine, which has produced a
> good crop this year in the Midlands. So thought I would make some
> wine. Got the books from the library, followed the directions, I felt
> pretty well.
>
> The must fermented well in the plastic bucket (SG started at 1.085,
> after added sugar), after 7 days I put it through a mesh and
> transferred to a demijohn (SG = 1.026) and put on an airlock. Kept it
> in the airing cupboard, which seemed nicely warm. But fermentation
> stopped. SG at 1.025. After 4 days, I tried to restart fermentation by
> preparing more yeast and adding it to it. But failed.
>
> I'm not sure where to go from here?
> (From the books, I'm supposed to ferment until the SG is < water.)
>
> Thanks for any help you can give. Sorry if this is a very novice
> question!
>
> Regards
> Mike

(Irene) wrote in message . com>...
> Another way to help a stuck fermentation is to stir daily. By getting
> rid of the CO2 and adding the little air that the yeasts require, you
> keep them at their happiest. Do this for a couple of days after you
> add the new yeast culture. I found this when fermenting pure
> sugars--the activity really picked up about an hour after I stirred
> out the CO2.
>
> The airing cupboard may be the culprit. Many winemakers tend to keep
> our carboys in corners (on a cement block to save the back) and not in
> cupboards. Or else the laundry room sink/table gets refitted to be the
> winemaking station. The lack of freely circulating air probably kept
> the CO2 too high and killed the yeasts. (it's sort of like dying if
> your kidneys fail and no dialysis...)
>
> After the primary fermentation, it is OK to hold the carboy at 15-18 C
> and it is more important to have constant temperature. Any open area
> that is free of dust or mould will do very well.--Irene
>
> (Mike) wrote in message . com>...
> > Hi folks,
> >
> > I'm new to wine making. I have a (red) grapevine, which has produced a
> > good crop this year in the Midlands. So thought I would make some
> > wine. Got the books from the library, followed the directions, I felt
> > pretty well.
> >
> > The must fermented well in the plastic bucket (SG started at 1.085,
> > after added sugar), after 7 days I put it through a mesh and
> > transferred to a demijohn (SG = 1.026) and put on an airlock. Kept it
> > in the airing cupboard, which seemed nicely warm. But fermentation
> > stopped. SG at 1.025. After 4 days, I tried to restart fermentation by
> > preparing more yeast and adding it to it. But failed.
> >
> > I'm not sure where to go from here?
> > (From the books, I'm supposed to ferment until the SG is < water.)
> >
> > Thanks for any help you can give. Sorry if this is a very novice
> > question!
> >
> > Regards
> > Mike


Thanks everyone...and for such a quick reply.

I'll know next year to keeping fermenting on the must until SG =
water. I checked the books I have, its not clear on this point,
inferring simply a set time period.

I'll start a new yeast colony last night, so I'll gradually add the
wine to that. Am I then better to put it back into the bucket rather
than the demijohn? If O2 is important, I guess having an air lock on a
demijohn would also stop fermentation?

Best wishes
Mike

Give it 3-4 days in the bucket (time depends on temp). When it
suddenyl clears, then rack to the DJ , add airlock, and keep in the
open room.

Irene
>
> I'll know next year to keeping fermenting on the must until SG =
> water. I checked the books I have, its not clear on this point,
> inferring simply a set time period.
>
> I'll start a new yeast colony last night, so I'll gradually add the
> wine to that. Am I then better to put it back into the bucket rather
> than the demijohn? If O2 is important, I guess having an air lock on a
> demijohn would also stop fermentation?
>
> Best wishes
> Mike

"Mike" > wrote in message
om...
> (Irene) wrote in message
. com>...
>snip.......
> The airing cupboard may be the culprit. Many winemakers tend to keep
> our carboys in corners (on a cement block to save the back) and not in
> cupboards. Or else the laundry room sink/table gets refitted to be the
> winemaking station. The lack of freely circulating air probably kept
> the CO2 too high and killed the yeasts. (it's sort of like dying if
> your kidneys fail and no dialysis...)

Irene,
There is no question that yeast requires oxygen at the beginning of
fermentation, but I am not aware that CO2 can kill yeast or stop an active
fermentation. Can you provide a reference?
Regards,
lum

> The must fermented well in the plastic bucket (SG started at 1.085,
> after added sugar), after 7 days I put it through a mesh and
> transferred to a demijohn (SG = 1.026) and put on an airlock. Kept it
> in the airing cupboard, which seemed nicely warm. But fermentation
> stopped. SG at 1.025. After 4 days, I tried to restart fermentation by
> preparing more yeast and adding it to it. But failed.

Did you punch down the cap at least 2 times per day during those 7
days it was fermenting?

On Sat, 15 Nov 2003, Lum wrote:
> Irene,
> There is no question that yeast requires oxygen at the beginning of
> fermentation, but I am not aware that CO2 can kill yeast or stop an active
> fermentation. Can you provide a reference?
> Regards,
> lum
I don't remember if CO2 kills the yeast, but if a fermentation is sealed
the pressure may become so great that the yeast will stop fermenting.
That's not what the original poster had in mind as we're usually talking
about fermentation in glass or wood (which would not contain the pressure
required to stop a ferment-boom!). Just thought this is an interesting
observation that I should share.
Warren Place

"Warren Place" > wrote in message
...
> On Sat, 15 Nov 2003, Lum wrote:
> > Irene,
> > There is no question that yeast requires oxygen at the beginning of
> > fermentation, but I am not aware that CO2 can kill yeast or stop an
active
> > fermentation. Can you provide a reference?
> > Regards,
> > lum
> I don't remember if CO2 kills the yeast, but if a fermentation is sealed
> the pressure may become so great that the yeast will stop fermenting.
> That's not what the original poster had in mind as we're usually talking
> about fermentation in glass or wood (which would not contain the pressure
> required to stop a ferment-boom!). Just thought this is an interesting
> observation that I should share.
> Warren Place

Thanks Warren, that's a good point. I looked up CO2 preservation of juice
in Bryce Rankine's book and he says the CO2 pressure needed to prevent
fermentation is 6 to 8 atmospheres (90 to 120 psi), so a husky tank is
required.
lum

On Sun, 16 Nov 2003, Lum wrote:
> "Warren Place" > wrote in message
> ...
> > I don't remember if CO2 kills the yeast, but if a fermentation is sealed
> > the pressure may become so great that the yeast will stop fermenting.
> > That's not what the original poster had in mind as we're usually talking
> > about fermentation in glass or wood (which would not contain the pressure
> > required to stop a ferment-boom!). Just thought this is an interesting
> > observation that I should share.
> > Warren Place
>
> Thanks Warren, that's a good point. I looked up CO2 preservation of juice
> in Bryce Rankine's book and he says the CO2 pressure needed to prevent
> fermentation is 6 to 8 atmospheres (90 to 120 psi), so a husky tank is
> required.
> lum
yes, a corney keg supposedly has a limit of 150psi. However, I
seem to remeber that once the pressure is released, the yeast will begin
fermenting again.
Warren Place

(Steve) wrote in message . com>...
> > The must fermented well in the plastic bucket (SG started at 1.085,
> > after added sugar), after 7 days I put it through a mesh and
> > transferred to a demijohn (SG = 1.026) and put on an airlock. Kept it
> > in the airing cupboard, which seemed nicely warm. But fermentation
> > stopped. SG at 1.025. After 4 days, I tried to restart fermentation by
> > preparing more yeast and adding it to it. But failed.
>
> Did you punch down the cap at least 2 times per day during those 7
> days it was fermenting?




Yes. The 1st 7 days all went well. But I guess the fermentation was
not yet complete and I put it in the DJ too soon.

I have tried to restart - gradually (I thought) adding 'wine' to the
yeast. It seemed to go well for the first day. All wine was added by
day 2, but now day 4 the SG is not reducing?? I guess I'll have to
restart and been even slower at adding the 'wine'.

Mike