The following URL will take you to a web special sale for an
alcohol hydrometer and test jar. The hydrometer measures both
percentage and proof.

http://www.alcoholcontrols.com/alhyd.html

Price Was
------- -------
Hydrometer $ 29,95 $ 42.95
Test jar 8.95 12.95
------- -------
$ 38.90 $ 55.90
plus
shipping

Sounds like a good deal to me. Anyone ever buy one of these?


Dick
--
Richard D. Adams, CPA
Moderator: misc.taxes.moderated

On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 18:51:50 -0000, (Dick Adams)
wrote:

>The following URL will take you to a web special sale for an
>alcohol hydrometer and test jar. The hydrometer measures both
>percentage and proof.
>
>http://www.alcoholcontrols.com/alhyd.html
>
> Price Was
> ------- -------
>Hydrometer $ 29,95 $ 42.95
>Test jar 8.95 12.95
> ------- -------
> $ 38.90 $ 55.90
>plus
> shipping
>
>Sounds like a good deal to me. Anyone ever buy one of these?
>
>
>Dick
Sounds like Spam to me

regular price for a hydrometer and test jar is $6.64 at my usual
outlet

$40+ will buy a lot of beer.

I quit using a hydrometer years ago. It doesn't really tell you
anything helpful, you risk contamination of the wort . . . what is the
use? bragging rights?

Dick,

That sounds expensive. Hydrometers are down around $6-7 for a regular
hydrometer. You can get narrow range hydrometers where you need a set of 3
hydrometers that cover the range that the inexpensive hydrometer covers.
The narrow range hydrometers are probably about $20 each so $60 for a set.
If that is what they are pricing, you do not really need that quality unless
you get real serious. Even then, I question whether the added accuracy of
the narrow range hydrometers really improve the accuracy of your alcohol
calculation. There is probably a 0.5 to 1.5% error in the calculation
methods so getting a better SG reading will not improve your estimate.

Ray

"Dick Adams" > wrote in message
...
> The following URL will take you to a web special sale for an
> alcohol hydrometer and test jar. The hydrometer measures both
> percentage and proof.
>
> http://www.alcoholcontrols.com/alhyd.html
>
> Price Was
> ------- -------
> Hydrometer $ 29,95 $ 42.95
> Test jar 8.95 12.95
> ------- -------
> $ 38.90 $ 55.90
> plus
> shipping
>
> Sounds like a good deal to me. Anyone ever buy one of these?
>
>
> Dick
> --
> Richard D. Adams, CPA
> Moderator: misc.taxes.moderated

Dick,

That sounds expensive. Hydrometers are down around $6-7 for a regular
hydrometer. You can get narrow range hydrometers where you need a set of 3
hydrometers that cover the range that the inexpensive hydrometer covers.
The narrow range hydrometers are probably about $20 each so $60 for a set.
If that is what they are pricing, you do not really need that quality unless
you get real serious. Even then, I question whether the added accuracy of
the narrow range hydrometers really improve the accuracy of your alcohol
calculation. There is probably a 0.5 to 1.5% error in the calculation
methods so getting a better SG reading will not improve your estimate.

Ray

"Dick Adams" > wrote in message
...
> The following URL will take you to a web special sale for an
> alcohol hydrometer and test jar. The hydrometer measures both
> percentage and proof.
>
> http://www.alcoholcontrols.com/alhyd.html
>
> Price Was
> ------- -------
> Hydrometer $ 29,95 $ 42.95
> Test jar 8.95 12.95
> ------- -------
> $ 38.90 $ 55.90
> plus
> shipping
>
> Sounds like a good deal to me. Anyone ever buy one of these?
>
>
> Dick
> --
> Richard D. Adams, CPA
> Moderator: misc.taxes.moderated

On Thu, 02 Dec 2004 04:09:21 GMT, MeadMax
> wrote:

>
>Well for a commercial operation you HAVE to know for purposes of
>labeling information and more importantly tax reporting.
>
>I think most people understand the basics of a 'specific gravity
>hydrometer' as used in brewing but those same people may not understand
>the difference between the graduations marked on a brix or proof scale
>hydrometer.
>
>There are few absolute accurate measures for alcohol by volume and that
>is why the (US) government only requires measurements to be accurate to
>.5% - 1.5% +- depending on the determined abv/proof
>
>Anyway, if anyone wants a real measurement of 'alcohol' let me know. I
>have an Anton Paar Alcolyzer.
>
>http://www.anton-paar.com/ap/apinter...lcowine_gr.jpg
>
>I only know a little about the subject ;-)
>
>
>Mike
>
Well OK it has a legal use. Are you a commercial brewer?

I think if I were looking for toys, a "High Performance Liquid
Chromatograph" would be my first choice. I could watch the flavor
develop, and the alcohol for that matter.

default wrote:
>>
>>Anyway, if anyone wants a real measurement of 'alcohol' let me know. I
>>have an Anton Paar Alcolyzer.
>>
>>http://www.anton-paar.com/ap/apinter...lcowine_gr.jpg
>>
>>I only know a little about the subject ;-)
>>
>>
>>Mike
>>
>
> Well OK it has a legal use. Are you a commercial brewer?
>
> I think if I were looking for toys, a "High Performance Liquid
> Chromatograph" would be my first choice. I could watch the flavor
> develop, and the alcohol for that matter.


Yes I am a commercial mead maker. I am also a commercial distiller.
I'd love to have a gas chromatograph (my friend at Agilent kees trying
to sell me one).

Mike
http://www.rabbitsfootmeadery.com

Try this web site:
http://www.wineandbeerfactory.com/
Go to test equipment. The price is a lot better! It is a Canadian site.
Eddie V.

"Dick Adams" > wrote in message
...
> The following URL will take you to a web special sale for an
> alcohol hydrometer and test jar. The hydrometer measures both
> percentage and proof.
>
> http://www.alcoholcontrols.com/alhyd.html
>
> Price Was
> ------- -------
> Hydrometer $ 29,95 $ 42.95
> Test jar 8.95 12.95
> ------- -------
> $ 38.90 $ 55.90
> plus
> shipping
>
> Sounds like a good deal to me. Anyone ever buy one of these?
>
>
> Dick
> --
> Richard D. Adams, CPA
> Moderator: misc.taxes.moderated

Try this web site:
http://www.wineandbeerfactory.com/
Go to test equipment. The price is a lot better! It is a Canadian site.
Eddie V.

"Dick Adams" > wrote in message
...
> The following URL will take you to a web special sale for an
> alcohol hydrometer and test jar. The hydrometer measures both
> percentage and proof.
>
> http://www.alcoholcontrols.com/alhyd.html
>
> Price Was
> ------- -------
> Hydrometer $ 29,95 $ 42.95
> Test jar 8.95 12.95
> ------- -------
> $ 38.90 $ 55.90
> plus
> shipping
>
> Sounds like a good deal to me. Anyone ever buy one of these?
>
>
> Dick
> --
> Richard D. Adams, CPA
> Moderator: misc.taxes.moderated

"Stephen SG" > wrote in message >...
>
> As for the Test jar I picked one up some 6 Months ago for less than $.
>
I must be some sort of weirdo then, I simply use the plastic tube the
hydrometer came in as a testing jar. It's tall enough, narrow enough
and free.

My tube was damaged, thus as it was so cheep what the hell.
Some of these hydrometers don't come plastic tubes.

As for you being a crack pot, well only you can judge or those around you.

Stephen SG

"Ralconte" > wrote in message
om...
| "Stephen SG" > wrote in message
>...
| >
| > As for the Test jar I picked one up some 6 Months ago for less than $.
| >
| I must be some sort of weirdo then, I simply use the plastic tube the
| hydrometer came in as a testing jar. It's tall enough, narrow enough
| and free.

My tube was damaged, thus as it was so cheep what the hell.
Some of these hydrometers don't come plastic tubes.

As for you being a crack pot, well only you can judge or those around you.

Stephen SG

"Ralconte" > wrote in message
om...
| "Stephen SG" > wrote in message
>...
| >
| > As for the Test jar I picked one up some 6 Months ago for less than $.
| >
| I must be some sort of weirdo then, I simply use the plastic tube the
| hydrometer came in as a testing jar. It's tall enough, narrow enough
| and free.

Ralconte > wrote:
>"Stephen SG" > wrote:

>> As for the Test jar I picked one up some 6 Months ago for less than $.

> I must be some sort of weirdo then.

So are most people -

> I simply use the plastic tube the hydrometer came in as a testing jar.
> It's tall enough, narrow enough and free.

If you have had it for a year or more and it has not cracked it,
you are one lucky guy.

Dick

Ralconte > wrote:
>"Stephen SG" > wrote:

>> As for the Test jar I picked one up some 6 Months ago for less than $.

> I must be some sort of weirdo then.

So are most people -

> I simply use the plastic tube the hydrometer came in as a testing jar.
> It's tall enough, narrow enough and free.

If you have had it for a year or more and it has not cracked it,
you are one lucky guy.

Dick

On Fri, 03 Dec 2004 02:21:04 GMT, "Duke" > wrote:

snip
>
>Hello default,
>
>At risk of sounding like a complete idiot; how do you know your fermentation
>is complete without the use of a hydrometer ? And why wouldn't you want to
>know the alcohol content of a given beverage ?
>
>Duke
>
>
I'm using two stage fermentation in glass. Back in the days when I
thought I needed a hydrometer, it was always the same reading (given
the same type and amount of sugar and yeast) Unless I screw up,
fermentation is more than over in two weeks. At two weeks and onward,
I check the brew periodically for clarity (with a flashlight through
the carboy). If it isn't clear in two weeks I give it one more -

One batch in 20 may still be a little cloudy at three weeks - I bottle
it and "archive" it (put it on the bottom of the stack so it gets used
last).

I would want to know the alcohol content - but only if there were no
downside to learning. To "know" the alcohol content you have to have
an accurate idea of the SG going in - that is almost never accurate in
my setup. And you still don't know the alcohol - just the SG, from
that you calculate and assume to know the alcohol.

Once my equipment is sanitized, the yeast is pitched, the wort
aerated, I'm loath to open the fermenter for any reason. To my way of
thinking that just makes good sense.

If I were using a conical fermenter taking a sample wouldn't risk
contamination and I might do things differently.

Besides, I've done hundreds of batches in 14+ years. When
fermentation is over it is visible - no airlock bubbles (or one every
10+ minutes), clear liquid, no froth on top, no bubbles on the
surface, etc..

If I had the SG and it wasn't "right," I might worry - there's not
like there's much I can do about it. My goal is a satisfying brew,
the effects of alcohol are secondary to taste.

From my experience sanitation is important, ditto good yeast, well
started, good selection of hops, and then careful temperature control.
(mixing and aerating wort are second nature now). Get the technique
down and good beer is the result.

There are NO hydrometers in the labs - they do use them in the
chemical manufacturing plant - but only as a crude measure. The
closest thing we have in the labs is an instrument that sends a sample
into a loop of glass tubing and vibrates the tubing, from the
frequency of the vibrating tube they calculate the density of the
liquid. To measure sugar, we use an instrument that measures optical
rotation (the sugar twists the polarized light passed through the
sample). To measure alcohol the gas chromatographs, or liquid
chromatographs are probably the accurate ways. GC measures the
ability of the sample to affect the ions (electrical conductivity) of
a flame or nuclear source detector, LC measures the absorption of a
particular wavelength of light (mostly UV), both measure when (time)
the sample elutes from the column - a sort of resistance to the
movement of certain molecules over others, and the magnitude of the
absorption or ionization voltage.

Experience biases perception.

When all is said and done, a satisfying beer is what it is all about,
not the alcohol content.

In article >, default says...
>I quit using a hydrometer years ago. It doesn't really tell you
>anything helpful, you risk contamination of the wort . . . what is the
>use?

Off the top of my head, I can think of several good reasons other than
calculating alcohol:

For beer, you need one to determine

1) mash and brewhouse efficiency
2) adjustment of hops in the kettle
3) problematic fermentation
4) when to start lagering phase
5) when fermentation is complete
6) wort fermentability


And since you crossposted to a winemaking group:

1) adjustments/dilutions prior to fermentation
2) problematic fermentations
3) final adjustments

I'm sure I left out a bunch.

The risk of contamination from taking a small sample post fermentation is nearly
zero assuming you can use reasonable sanitation procedures. For wort, the
greatest risk is prior to fermentation. If you're not able to take a small
hydrometer sample of fermented wort without introducing an infection, there's
little hope that you'll be able to produce a decent non-infected beer to begin
with.

In article >, default says...
>I quit using a hydrometer years ago. It doesn't really tell you
>anything helpful, you risk contamination of the wort . . . what is the
>use?

Off the top of my head, I can think of several good reasons other than
calculating alcohol:

For beer, you need one to determine

1) mash and brewhouse efficiency
2) adjustment of hops in the kettle
3) problematic fermentation
4) when to start lagering phase
5) when fermentation is complete
6) wort fermentability


And since you crossposted to a winemaking group:

1) adjustments/dilutions prior to fermentation
2) problematic fermentations
3) final adjustments

I'm sure I left out a bunch.

The risk of contamination from taking a small sample post fermentation is nearly
zero assuming you can use reasonable sanitation procedures. For wort, the
greatest risk is prior to fermentation. If you're not able to take a small
hydrometer sample of fermented wort without introducing an infection, there's
little hope that you'll be able to produce a decent non-infected beer to begin
with.

25+ years actually, but who is counting, the one I was using was glass.

Stephen SG


"Dick Adams" > wrote in message
...
| Ralconte > wrote:
| >"Stephen SG" > wrote:
|
| >> As for the Test jar I picked one up some 6 Months ago for less than $.
|
| > I must be some sort of weirdo then.
|
| So are most people -
|
| > I simply use the plastic tube the hydrometer came in as a testing jar.
| > It's tall enough, narrow enough and free.
|
| If you have had it for a year or more and it has not cracked it,
| you are one lucky guy.
|
| Dick
|

I agree with your Comments, despite the fact some including my self who have
this equipment,
I rarely use it.
A good wine is not based on how much alcohol is within but on the pleasing
properties it presents.

I trust that others have different views...................

Stephen SG

"default" > wrote in message
...
| On Fri, 03 Dec 2004 02:21:04 GMT, "Duke" > wrote:
|
| snip
| >
| >Hello default,
| >
| >At risk of sounding like a complete idiot; how do you know your
fermentation
| >is complete without the use of a hydrometer ? And why wouldn't you want
to
| >know the alcohol content of a given beverage ?
| >
| >Duke
| >
| >
| I'm using two stage fermentation in glass. Back in the days when I
| thought I needed a hydrometer, it was always the same reading (given
| the same type and amount of sugar and yeast) Unless I screw up,
| fermentation is more than over in two weeks. At two weeks and onward,
| I check the brew periodically for clarity (with a flashlight through
| the carboy). If it isn't clear in two weeks I give it one more -
|
| One batch in 20 may still be a little cloudy at three weeks - I bottle
| it and "archive" it (put it on the bottom of the stack so it gets used
| last).
|
| I would want to know the alcohol content - but only if there were no
| downside to learning. To "know" the alcohol content you have to have
| an accurate idea of the SG going in - that is almost never accurate in
| my setup. And you still don't know the alcohol - just the SG, from
| that you calculate and assume to know the alcohol.
|
| Once my equipment is sanitized, the yeast is pitched, the wort
| aerated, I'm loath to open the fermenter for any reason. To my way of
| thinking that just makes good sense.
|
| If I were using a conical fermenter taking a sample wouldn't risk
| contamination and I might do things differently.
|
| Besides, I've done hundreds of batches in 14+ years. When
| fermentation is over it is visible - no airlock bubbles (or one every
| 10+ minutes), clear liquid, no froth on top, no bubbles on the
| surface, etc..
|
| If I had the SG and it wasn't "right," I might worry - there's not
| like there's much I can do about it. My goal is a satisfying brew,
| the effects of alcohol are secondary to taste.
|
| From my experience sanitation is important, ditto good yeast, well
| started, good selection of hops, and then careful temperature control.
| (mixing and aerating wort are second nature now). Get the technique
| down and good beer is the result.
|
| There are NO hydrometers in the labs - they do use them in the
| chemical manufacturing plant - but only as a crude measure. The
| closest thing we have in the labs is an instrument that sends a sample
| into a loop of glass tubing and vibrates the tubing, from the
| frequency of the vibrating tube they calculate the density of the
| liquid. To measure sugar, we use an instrument that measures optical
| rotation (the sugar twists the polarized light passed through the
| sample). To measure alcohol the gas chromatographs, or liquid
| chromatographs are probably the accurate ways. GC measures the
| ability of the sample to affect the ions (electrical conductivity) of
| a flame or nuclear source detector, LC measures the absorption of a
| particular wavelength of light (mostly UV), both measure when (time)
| the sample elutes from the column - a sort of resistance to the
| movement of certain molecules over others, and the magnitude of the
| absorption or ionization voltage.
|
| Experience biases perception.
|
| When all is said and done, a satisfying beer is what it is all about,
| not the alcohol content.

"default" > wrote in message
...
> On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 18:51:50 -0000, (Dick Adams)
> wrote:
>
> >The following URL will take you to a web special sale for an
> >alcohol hydrometer and test jar. The hydrometer measures both
> >percentage and proof.
> >
> >http://www.alcoholcontrols.com/alhyd.html
> >
> > Price Was
> > ------- -------
> >Hydrometer $ 29,95 $ 42.95
> >Test jar 8.95 12.95
> > ------- -------
> > $ 38.90 $ 55.90
> >plus
> > shipping
> >
> >Sounds like a good deal to me. Anyone ever buy one of these?
> >
> >
> >Dick
> Sounds like Spam to me
>
> regular price for a hydrometer and test jar is $6.64 at my usual
> outlet

This is for an ALCOHOL hydrometer, not a water hydrometer. Note that it
reads percentage and proof, NOT specific gravity.
Bob<><
>
> $40+ will buy a lot of beer.
>
> I quit using a hydrometer years ago. It doesn't really tell you
> anything helpful, you risk contamination of the wort . . . what is the
> use? bragging rights?

"Dick Adams" > wrote in message
...
> Ralconte > wrote:
> >"Stephen SG" > wrote:
>
> >> As for the Test jar I picked one up some 6 Months ago for less than $.
>
> > I must be some sort of weirdo then.
>
> So are most people -
>
> > I simply use the plastic tube the hydrometer came in as a testing jar.
> > It's tall enough, narrow enough and free.
>
> If you have had it for a year or more and it has not cracked it,
> you are one lucky guy.

Mine is 25 years old. Works like a charm, and the plastic tube is just
the right size for a good first taste! :-)
Bob<><
--
"A 90 year old man was arrested and charged with rape.
He was so flattered that he pled guilty. -George Burns-
>
> Dick
>

On Sat, 4 Dec 2004 13:57:57 -0500, "B0B" > wrote:

>
>"default" > wrote in message
.. .
>> On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 18:51:50 -0000, (Dick Adams)
>> wrote:
>>
>> >The following URL will take you to a web special sale for an
>> >alcohol hydrometer and test jar. The hydrometer measures both
>> >percentage and proof.
>> >
>> >http://www.alcoholcontrols.com/alhyd.html
>> >
>> > Price Was
>> > ------- -------
>> >Hydrometer $ 29,95 $ 42.95
>> >Test jar 8.95 12.95
>> > ------- -------
>> > $ 38.90 $ 55.90
>> >plus
>> > shipping
>> >
>> >Sounds like a good deal to me. Anyone ever buy one of these?
>> >
>> >
>> >Dick
>> Sounds like Spam to me
>>
>> regular price for a hydrometer and test jar is $6.64 at my usual
>> outlet
>
> This is for an ALCOHOL hydrometer, not a water hydrometer. Note that it
>reads percentage and proof, NOT specific gravity.
> Bob<><

Your statement is incorrect. The hydrometer isn't specific to
alcohol. It is an ordinary hydrometer "marked-calibrated" in
percentage and proof instead of just specific gravity. It can only
measure specific gravity - even if it "reads" in proof.

Sort of like fahrenheit and celsius on a thermometer scale. No magic
- just numbers. Instead of going to a chart to convert the SG to
alcohol you read the proof from the float. (and still correct for
temperature most likely)

But all it really tells you is SG, NOT the alcohol.

To know alcohol with even a hope of accuracy you'd need to know the SG
of the water (assumed to be "one"), the SG of the wort at starting of
fermentation and the finished beer.

But, basically, what they are selling is a high priced hydrometer with
a scale to make it quick and easy to check for pilferage among the bar
staff. (and a very inaccurate one if not temperature compensated)

On Sat, 4 Dec 2004 13:57:57 -0500, "B0B" > wrote:

>
>"default" > wrote in message
.. .
>> On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 18:51:50 -0000, (Dick Adams)
>> wrote:
>>
>> >The following URL will take you to a web special sale for an
>> >alcohol hydrometer and test jar. The hydrometer measures both
>> >percentage and proof.
>> >
>> >http://www.alcoholcontrols.com/alhyd.html
>> >
>> > Price Was
>> > ------- -------
>> >Hydrometer $ 29,95 $ 42.95
>> >Test jar 8.95 12.95
>> > ------- -------
>> > $ 38.90 $ 55.90
>> >plus
>> > shipping
>> >
>> >Sounds like a good deal to me. Anyone ever buy one of these?
>> >
>> >
>> >Dick
>> Sounds like Spam to me
>>
>> regular price for a hydrometer and test jar is $6.64 at my usual
>> outlet
>
> This is for an ALCOHOL hydrometer, not a water hydrometer. Note that it
>reads percentage and proof, NOT specific gravity.
> Bob<><

Your statement is incorrect. The hydrometer isn't specific to
alcohol. It is an ordinary hydrometer "marked-calibrated" in
percentage and proof instead of just specific gravity. It can only
measure specific gravity - even if it "reads" in proof.

Sort of like fahrenheit and celsius on a thermometer scale. No magic
- just numbers. Instead of going to a chart to convert the SG to
alcohol you read the proof from the float. (and still correct for
temperature most likely)

But all it really tells you is SG, NOT the alcohol.

To know alcohol with even a hope of accuracy you'd need to know the SG
of the water (assumed to be "one"), the SG of the wort at starting of
fermentation and the finished beer.

But, basically, what they are selling is a high priced hydrometer with
a scale to make it quick and easy to check for pilferage among the bar
staff. (and a very inaccurate one if not temperature compensated)

"Ralconte" > wrote in message
om...
> "Stephen SG" > wrote in message
> >...
>>
>> As for the Test jar I picked one up some 6 Months ago for less than $.
>>
> I must be some sort of weirdo then, I simply use the plastic tube the
> hydrometer came in as a testing jar. It's tall enough, narrow enough
> and free.

Ralconte,

Not so weird, I use the tube also. That, or the one my floating thermometer
came in. They are nearly identical, and both work well for this purpose.


--
Cheers,
Ken