I started my first batch from concentrate, before I added the yeast I
did an acid test. It was low so I added some acid blend. It didn't
change so I added more, too much more. The acid test showed a 1.35
following the instructions and the multiplier given. According to my
books it shouldn't be higher than 0.65. The PH was 2.0 and that was
the lowest the strip would go. I really messed up. The acid reducing
powder I have will only reduce acid levels .15 per liter, way not
enough. I guess I'm screwed. Chalk this one up to trying to do it to
fast. Anyone need some metal etched?

GT

wrote:
> I started my first batch from concentrate, before I added the yeast I
> did an acid test. It was low so I added some acid blend. It didn't
> change so I added more, too much more. The acid test showed a 1.35
> following the instructions and the multiplier given. According to my
> books it shouldn't be higher than 0.65. The PH was 2.0 and that was
> the lowest the strip would go. I really messed up. The acid reducing
> powder I have will only reduce acid levels .15 per liter, way not
> enough. I guess I'm screwed. Chalk this one up to trying to do it to
> fast. Anyone need some metal etched?
>
> GT

Too bad about the mishap. For future reference, acid cannot be reliably
measured on concentrates before fermentation - the value will be
artificially low because apparently part of the acid is bound to other
things during concentration and only released via the ferment. Sounds
like that might have been the cause of the problem here.

Always double check measured numbers with your senses. Rough acid
levels are easy to tell by taste, with some previous experience.

As for this wine, you could always try to take some samples and add
sugar and maybe blend with other wine to see if you can save it.
Throwing things out should really be the last resort.

Pp

I've already dumped the batch, I was hoping to try and save it but
after tasting it was apparent that it was a hopeless cause. If I would
have blended it with other wine I would have ruin much more.
Thanks for the advice PP, I will start another batch soon. I will be
more patient this time.

You COULD have saved it and for future reference you might try to do
so. It would have been a good learning experience.

Of the three main acids found in acid blends, 2 can be removed through
fermentation processes. Citric acid (citrate) is a key metabolite in
oxidative metabolism of yeast and it can get used up to an extent
during fermentation. malic acid can be removed by using certain yeast
and by MLF. Finally tartaric acid can be removed by adding calcium
(via calcium carbonate) and then cold stabilization.

What I would have tried is adding calcium carbonate to the must to
bring up the pH to the high 2s or up to the 3s. This will allow
fermentation to proceed (really low pHs inhibit yeast activity). Then
ferment aerobically for several days to try and use up a bit of the
citric acid. Finally let the wine undergo MLF, or use Lalvin 71B-1122
(I might have actually tried both). Then after fermentation, check the
acidity again and if needed use tartaric acid to bring it back up...if
it is still way to high, cold stabilize the wine rack it off the
tartrate crystals and check the pH and TA again. You can always add
more calcium carbonate. The carbonate will react with the acid and go
out as CO2. The Calcium will react with the tartrate crystals and
precipitate out. You can also use potassium carbonate (but this is
harder to find).


Just remember, there is ALWAYS a solution that can be tried. It may
not always work, but do not give up until you try at least. You might
end up wasting time in the end, but the experience is invaluable.

You COULD have saved it and for future reference you might try to do
so. It would have been a good learning experience.

Of the three main acids found in acid blends, 2 can be removed through
fermentation processes. Citric acid (citrate) is a key metabolite in
oxidative metabolism of yeast and it can get used up to an extent
during fermentation. malic acid can be removed by using certain yeast
and by MLF. Finally tartaric acid can be removed by adding calcium
(via calcium carbonate) and then cold stabilization.

What I would have tried is adding calcium carbonate to the must to
bring up the pH to the high 2s or up to the 3s. This will allow
fermentation to proceed (really low pHs inhibit yeast activity). Then
ferment aerobically for several days to try and use up a bit of the
citric acid. Finally let the wine undergo MLF, or use Lalvin 71B-1122
(I might have actually tried both). Then after fermentation, check the
acidity again and if needed use tartaric acid to bring it back up...if
it is still way to high, cold stabilize the wine rack it off the
tartrate crystals and check the pH and TA again. You can always add
more calcium carbonate. The carbonate will react with the acid and go
out as CO2. The Calcium will react with the tartrate crystals and
precipitate out. You can also use potassium carbonate (but this is
harder to find).


Just remember, there is ALWAYS a solution that can be tried. It may
not always work, but do not give up until you try at least. You might
end up wasting time in the end, but the experience is invaluable.

Droopy,
I will consult this newgroup the next batch, or when I make another
mistake.
I was going to try a kit wine. They say everything is spelled out for
us newbies. I should have gone that route first.
I won't dump anymore wine, but I will wait to get more experience
before I try anything else.
Thanks for your advice, if you don't mind I seek you out in the
future.
GT

On 3 Nov 2005 09:44:20 -0800, "Droopy" > wrote:

>You COULD have saved it and for future reference you might try to do
>so. It would have been a good learning experience.
>
>Of the three main acids found in acid blends, 2 can be removed through
>fermentation processes. Citric acid (citrate) is a key metabolite in
>oxidative metabolism of yeast and it can get used up to an extent
>during fermentation. malic acid can be removed by using certain yeast
>and by MLF. Finally tartaric acid can be removed by adding calcium
>(via calcium carbonate) and then cold stabilization.
>
>What I would have tried is adding calcium carbonate to the must to
>bring up the pH to the high 2s or up to the 3s. This will allow
>fermentation to proceed (really low pHs inhibit yeast activity). Then
>ferment aerobically for several days to try and use up a bit of the
>citric acid. Finally let the wine undergo MLF, or use Lalvin 71B-1122
>(I might have actually tried both). Then after fermentation, check the
>acidity again and if needed use tartaric acid to bring it back up...if
>it is still way to high, cold stabilize the wine rack it off the
>tartrate crystals and check the pH and TA again. You can always add
>more calcium carbonate. The carbonate will react with the acid and go
>out as CO2. The Calcium will react with the tartrate crystals and
>precipitate out. You can also use potassium carbonate (but this is
>harder to find).
>
>
>Just remember, there is ALWAYS a solution that can be tried. It may
>not always work, but do not give up until you try at least. You might
>end up wasting time in the end, but the experience is invaluable.

Nicely said. Some the most well liked wines I have made started out as
a fiasco. I don't think I have ever seen the need to throw a whole
batch away.

Joe


Droopy wrote:
> You COULD have saved it and for future reference you might try to do
> so. It would have been a good learning experience.
>
>
> Just remember, there is ALWAYS a solution that can be tried. It may
> not always work, but do not give up until you try at least. You might
> end up wasting time in the end, but the experience is invaluable.

"Joe Sallustio" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> Nicely said. Some the most well liked wines I have made started out as
> a fiasco. I don't think I have ever seen the need to throw a whole
> batch away.

In the case of an over-acidified wine, I tend to agree. OTOH, as a judge on
panels evaluating home wines in competition, I have definitely tasted more
than a few wines that were well beyond salvage and should have been dumped.
I sometimes wonder why anyone would waste a cork and bottle (not to mention
the entry fee) on such a wine. Maybe they just wanted the tasting notes...

Tom S

Yeah, but then you could use to to marinate meat or burn off warts.